LCD TV as monitor using composite in or rf -B & W image

[Noelio]

As the subject says...

 

I've tried it on my 32" as well as a brand new, as of today, 19 inch widescreen and all I'm getting is B & W.

I tried 2 800xls

1 1200

 

Do we need some kind of linear amplifier or a scan converter to use LCD screens?

[+remowilliams]

Do we need some kind of linear amplifier or a scan converter to use LCD screens?

You shouldn't, not as far as composite/RF (provided the display has those connections). However modern displays increasingly dislike the ragged (and often out of spec) signals that are put out by ancient equipment. Some displays won't show the image, some might display b/w. Others look plain horrible depending on their internal scalers even if they will process the signal.

[danwinslow]

I use them, they look GREAT. Yo do have to find one that can handle the signal, but a lot of the newer ones do. Try using monitor output or Svideo rather than RF output.

[JamesD]

I've tried the output of about every old computer I have with my Magnavox 15" LCD TV/Monitor and there isn't much that works. However, I've seen the same monitor working great with an RGB to VGA converter box on a Tandy Coco3. I don't know if the box will work with an Atari without mods but the picture was beautiful.

Edited April 6, 2007 by JamesD

[Noelio]

I use them, they look GREAT. Yo do have to find one that can handle the signal, but a lot of the newer ones do. Try using monitor output or Svideo rather than RF output.

I got an Atari monitor - s-video cable ordered. Hopefully that will fix it.

I think I'm going to trash a monitor cable to try to make a sloppy temp cable.

 

If it doesn't work with that, I should return the TV & get another one. This one was the cheapest I could find on the net or anywhere, figured it would be good enough for atari resolution if it can do svga & up hehehe.

I'll cross my fingers and go destroy an svideo & monitor cable to try it.

[+remowilliams]

figured it would be good enough for atari resolution if it can do svga & up hehehe.

Unfortunately those two aren't related.

 

Good luck! If you get an s-video cable going, and the LCD still doesn't like it - find another LCD

[Noelio]

figured it would be good enough for atari resolution if it can do svga & up hehehe.

Unfortunately those two aren't related.

 

Good luck! If you get an s-video cable going, and the LCD still doesn't like it - find another LCD

 

 

Hrrrm it likes the XEGS, BUT... The XEGS takes 10 minutes to warm up before it displays 'ready'... Hahaha.

If that dont work I'll get an upscan converter I guess and try that.

 

I'd be happy with the XE, just tha tthe whole miami vice neon pastel buttons throw me off!

It feels like I should be eating it instead of playing games on it.

[+remowilliams]

I'd be happy with the XE, just tha tthe whole miami vice neon pastel buttons throw me off!

I always put on my linen suit while playing the XEGS!

 

 

[Curt Vendel]

I wish it would've been more like the Mega ST case so that a monitor or small tv could've been placed onto it, as it is, with he console and keyboard the depth takes up way too much space in front of a display and the keyboard cable doesn't really afford all that much room. It is nice however to have an XE with a detachable keyboard - those pastel buttons really ruin the whole thing though :-(

 

 

Curt

 

I'd be happy with the XE, just tha tthe whole miami vice neon pastel buttons throw me off!

I always put on my linen suit while playing the XEGS!

 

 

[Urchlay]

those pastel buttons really ruin the whole thing though :-(

 

That, and not having Reset/Select/Option/Start on the detachable part of the keyboard... you end up using these buttons often enough that you'll have to keep reaching for the console. I guess that's why they made the keyboard cable so short (at least you can get an extender for that though).

[danwinslow]

Upscan converters work, but they look like crap. Don't waste your money, as I did. The best LCD I have found is a Magnavox 15" HDTV.

[Tezz]

This thread appeared at the right time for me, I was about to ask about using an LCD TV. Personally now that I'm setting things back up with moving house, I'm putting my XE and towered Amiga set-up together, the Amiga was modded to the max in 1996 and has the output via Picasso to a 17" CRT monitor and also a scan doubler/vga output for the Amiga's output with a switch mounted to toggle between the two... the 15" LCD TV's I'm looking at have both RF, scart and also VGA input so hopefully this will support both my Amiga and XE and save the space wasted with a big 17" CRT and 15" Sony TV that I had dedicated for each previously.

 

I'll post back how good/bad it turns out as I'm picking one up today.

[puppetmark]

My brother bought a K word TV BOX 1440 to use as a tuner with his LCD monitor, so I brought my super video 600XL to his house to test the box and LCD monitor. AT FIRST it looked really poor. lots of shadows and muted colors. BUT, the box has lots of adjustments. After we turned down the sharpness, andusted thhe contrast, tint and color temp, it looked very nice. better than the video inputs on a CRT TV.

 

My advice is that the upconverters CAN work but buy one with lots of adjustment options as the Atari 8-bits do not have 100% standard legal video circuits. The tolerences are not very tight. They are just fine for the analog world, but not so when dealing with the more precise inputs of scan doubler ICs.

 

This is the one We worked with:

 

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Se...&CatId=1427

 

With that said, maybe we should start a FAQ about wich converters work best with the 8-bits.

Edited April 6, 2007 by puppetmark

[Tezz]

I decided not to just jump in and buy one today and instead look into the specs of many and make an informed decision.

 

It would seem that most of the cheaper lcd tv's are around 16ms response time and also have lower contrast ratio's (commonly around 400:1). These specs are pretty low so I'm looking at a 700:1 with 8ms... but I'm wondering about other important issues also. Unlike CRT based displays, TFT screens have a native resolution which has 1:1 pixel ratio, only these resolutions look crisp and clear. Displaying lower resolutions shows calculated scaling much like sizing an image on a picture editor on your computer. The sizing of the display in this way is uneven and looks poor

 

so.... this begs the first question of which size of tft display is best to use? A 15" TFT (non ws) has a native resolution 800x600 and a 17" TFT (non ws) has a native resolution 1024x768. I'm not certain of how the Atari outputs it's lower resolution display but certainly pc graphics cards displaying 320x240 looks blurred on the tft with it's internal scaling.

 

There's a lot of questions running through my mind:

 

Would the response time be an issue with screen updating from the Atari? how about raster effects ? could that show up strange output problems? (I don't think any of that would be an issue but i'm not 100% sure about that)

 

Is a component video output via the Atari's monitor din acceptable or would an s-video via the modification to the motherboard produce a significantly better output? rf output is always terrible so is not an option i would ever concider using

 

Also is there a definitive universal answer to the best output or is it dependent on whether you are NTSC or PAL?

 

Any thoughts anyone ???

Edited April 6, 2007 by Tezz

[+bf2k+]

 

...

 

This is the one We worked with:

 

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Se...&CatId=1427

 

With that said, maybe we should start a FAQ about wich converters work best with the 8-bits.

 

ABSOLUTELY!!!

[+remowilliams]

so.... this begs the first question of which size of tft display is best to use? A 15" TFT (non ws) has a native resolution 800x600 and a 17" TFT (non ws) has a native resolution 1024x768. I'm not certain of how the Atari outputs it's lower resolution display but certainly pc graphics cards displaying 320x240 looks blurred on the tft with it's internal scaling.

Remember, we're not driving RGB here with these old machines, so resolution is largely irrelevant - what matters immensely is the quality of the LCDs internal scaler.

 

Would the response time be an issue with screen updating from the Atari? how about raster effects ? could that show up strange output problems? (I don't think any of that would be an issue but i'm not 100% sure about that)

 

Is a component video output via the Atari's monitor din acceptable or would an s-video via the modification to the motherboard produce a significantly better output? rf output is always terrible so is not an option i would ever concider using

 

If the LCDs scaler is slow and crappy and adds a noticeable response time while scaling the image for display - then you'll see a control lag problem.

 

I take it you mean composite, and while some people will deem it acceptable the s-video quality is far superior. Even better with a clearpic or similar video circuitry mod inside the Atari.

[Tezz]

Remember, we're not driving RGB here with these old machines, so resolution is largely irrelevant - what matters immensely is the quality of the LCDs internal scaler.

that's good to hear that it won't be the same situation in the issues with the output here

 

If the LCDs scaler is slow and crappy and adds a noticeable response time while scaling the image for display - then you'll see a control lag problem.

That's a good point.. I suppose only trial and error in using various models will enable me to see whether the scaler is good or bad because that's something the manufacturers will not specify in their documentation.

 

I take it you mean composite, and while some people will deem it acceptable the s-video quality is far superior. Even better with a clearpic or similar video circuitry mod inside the Atari.

I will definately do the clearpic s-video modification on my XE in that case.

 

I guess i will buy the tft tv and keep my fingers crossed that the scaler is fast... I'm hoping so going for a more expensive model with 8ms response time and other higher specs that the scaler will also be better on this model

[Tezz]

Further to this discussion, are most people here still opting for the capture card solution through their pc/mac to output to a monitor? I'd rather not do that myself as I want the Atari to be stand alone and also in any case my pc will be set-up in a different part of the room

[Noelio]

Hrrrm it might be a good idea to add a sticky hardware compatibility list divided into sections.

I know this 19 " proview lcd likes the AV out from the XEGS, but not the composite from the 800XL.

Going to keep the display as I will just add a VCR is I need to. That should 'amp up' the signal enough.

 

Haha it seems everyone else has the same attitude towards the miami vice pastel / neon XEGS buttons.

With Easter being this weekend, I think the buttons are rather fitting.

 

Have a good weekend / Easter folks.

Noelio