NTSC Games on Pal System

[robatari]

I'm sure this is an easy question, but I've struggled to find a consistent answer.

 

Numerous sources say games of one type (PAL/NTSC) won't work on a console of the other type. However, on the conversion page of this site, it states most NTSC games will work on a PAL system, but not vice versa.

 

Is this the case? I guessed the differing number of scanlines would mess things up, but I can almost imagine that the games would play, just at a slightly different pace. And if indeed it is just "most" NTSC games that work on a PAL system, is there any easy way to find out which, and what is the reason for this?

[A.J. Franzman]

The consoles themselves really don't care; any game should work on any system*. If the TV and console are of the same region, then the game will appear with color and sound. However, the colors may be incorrect and the screen may roll if the region of the cartridge differs from that of the console + TV. Most PAL TVs tolerate a 60 Hz picture (NTSC cartridge) and do not roll. But, many NTSC TVs have trouble with a 50 Hz picture (PAL cartridge) and will roll, unless the TV is old enough to have a Vertical Hold adjustment, which can be used to compensate.

 

*some versions of a few games are known to be incompatible with certain console models such as Heavy Sixers and 7800s; but this is unrelated to the region-incompatibility issue

Edited June 18, 2008 by A.J. Franzman

[theking21083]

I have a PAL 2600 that I use on a NTSC TV with NTSC games and all 187 of my games work perfect.

[A.J. Franzman]

I have a PAL 2600 that I use on a NTSC TV with NTSC games and all 187 of my games work perfect.

Your TV must be multi-standard then, because an NTSC-only TV will not understand the color encoding of a PAL console -- the games would all appear in black & white.

[theking21083]

I have hooked up my 2600 to all of the TV's in my house and taken it to other locations and it has never given me trouble. It has been on new and old tv's but always works fine.

[A.J. Franzman]

... then it must not be a PAL console. What makes you think it's PAL? Can you post a photo of the motherboard? I've seen photos here of some consoles that had "PAL" marked on them in odd places (such as on top of the RF modulator shielding), that did not appear to be PAL units.

Edited June 16, 2008 by A.J. Franzman

[theking21083]

I'll post a pic. It has a marking on it on the inside showing it's pal and when I got it, I posted pictures of it on here and I was told that it was pal by a few people. It might be an NTSC, you would know better then me.

[theking21083]

Here are some pics I took of my 2600. There is a sticker on the RF that says PAL. These are all taken on my cellphone so hopefully they are decent.

 

[robatari]

Thanks for the reply. My TV claims to do PAL, NTSC and SECAM, so I think I'll just get some NTSC carts and see what happens.

[Mayhem]

Europeans TVs do handle NTSC fine but through the AV channels, not the RF connection. To play NTSC 2600 games properly, I've got an AV modded NTSC 7800 here. Although you may be in possession of one of the rare TVs that does have an NTSC tuner inside, but it is doubtful.

 

Playing NTSC 2600 games on a PAL 2600 through RF will most of the time give a stable picture but wrong colours.

[Cassidy Nolen]

My NTSC TV and NTSC console will in fact play color correct PAL games. Its about 8 years old (51 inch Panasonic) but it does tend to pinch the picture in the center. Some games, like Obelix, display too low on the screen to actually play, most are just fine.

 

Fatal Run, Cakewalk, RS Soccer, even some 32 in 1 Activsion action all work just fine. Its the only TV I have that will do it, if you run it through a VCR to an RCA input it will not work; just through the tuner. I think its trying to capture and lock on to the signal through a digital tuner. Thats what I have tought anyway

 

C

[A.J. Franzman]

Here are some pics I took of my 2600. There is a sticker on the RF that says PAL. These are all taken on my cellphone so hopefully they are decent.

That may be one of the "PAL"-marked consoles I remembered seeing before. Your cellphone might give good enough pictures, but I can't tell from those you provided above whether it's really PAL because the motherboard is still inside the shielding -- I need to see the circuitry and components.

[theking21083]

Alright I'll see what I can do.

[A.J. Franzman]

My NTSC TV and NTSC console will in fact play color correct PAL games.

Have you been tested for color vision deficiency? Have you compared your PAL game screens to online screenshots? The NTSC and PAL TIA chips have different color tables; it's impossible for PAL cartridges to display correct colors using an NTSC console. It's conceivable that there are a few games which (by coincidence or design) only use colors that happen to be very similar in the NTSC and PAL tables (hues 2, 4, 6, 9 and B are pretty close in both tables) but I don't know of any offhand.

 

See TIA Color Charts; notice that the NTSC colors flow in a smooth rainbow gradient, while the PAL colors alternate from opposite ends of the spectrum. Also, three of the NTSC hues become grays (or black, or white, depending on luminance) in the PAL table.

Edited June 17, 2008 by A.J. Franzman

[theking21083]

Here are 2 more pics. Hopefully this will do the trick.

 

[A.J. Franzman]

Here are 2 more pics. Hopefully this will do the trick.

 

Well, showing me the other side would have made it much easier, but by comparing those photos to a Rev. C NTSC board I have here, that does appear to be an NTSC board.

[theking21083]

I wonder why Atari would put a PAL label on their systems that are NTSC.

[Cassidy Nolen]

Let me re-word that...they play color games that look to be close to the original colors. I have not had a vision check in a few years but I do instruct high-speed driving (vision is pretty good ).

 

Man you are spending a lot of time defending that it all won't work and you've got people showing/telling you it does. Whatever works works...

 

 

C

[A.J. Franzman]

I started out only trying to provide the OP robatari with an accurate answer. "Whatever works works...", aint it.

 

Then came responses saying I was in error, and I'm just trying to find out why people believe my answer was wrong. So far, the reasons aren't holding up to my satisfaction.

[A.J. Franzman]

I wonder why Atari would put a PAL label on their systems that are NTSC.

I have no factual knowledge of the reason, but a simple manufacturing error is not out of the question. It's merely a sticker on the inside where the consumer is not meant to ever see it, after all. Atari actually produced and released a fairly large number of Joust cartridges in NTSC format which bear the PAL "P" mark on the end label, so something as trivial as your board's sticker is quite plausible.

Edited June 18, 2008 by A.J. Franzman