New Atari 7800 release

[holygrailvideogames.com]

I just received this email.

 

hi,

we are pleased to announce a new game for the 7800, combat 1990. it

is a one player vs. the computer, or two player head to head game,

price is $39.95. reserve yours today.

thanks,

lance

www.atarisales.com

[+MrFish]

I just received this email.

 

hi,

  we are pleased to announce a new game for the 7800, combat 1990. it

is a one player vs. the computer, or two player head to head game,

price is $39.95. reserve yours today.

thanks,

lance

www.atarisales.com

967822[/snapback]

 

Any screenshots or anything?

[Fellow Atari Man]

Interesting e-mail.

 

And the prices for their boxed 7800 games are OUTRAGEOUS.

[+Mitch]

I think that's the one Harry wrote for the 7800 homebrew contest. I believe there are screenshots around somewhere. Basically it's a 7800 update of the old 2600 game with several new twists thrown in.

 

Mitch

[Harry_Dodgson]

The previous thread here at AtariAge is at:

http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=70888&hl=

 

You can see screendumps at:

http://www.staticgamer.com/gallery/showpho.../cat/501/page/1

 

Harry

[DracIsBack]

Interesting e-mail.

 

And the prices for their boxed 7800 games are OUTRAGEOUS.

967841[/snapback]

 

 

Sadly, the playing field isn't level. When liquidating Atari, the Tramiels dumped millions of 2600 and 7800 cartridges to O'Sheas, while not discounting the dealers who had paid full distribution price for them.

 

So, O'Sheas is able to sell them for $5/unit whereas dealers like Video 61 would lose tons of money on each cart.

[video game addict]

Interesting e-mail.

 

And the prices for their boxed 7800 games are OUTRAGEOUS.

967841[/snapback]

 

 

Sadly, the playing field isn't level. When liquidating Atari, the Tramiels dumped millions of 2600 and 7800 cartridges to O'Sheas, while not discounting the dealers who had paid full distribution price for them.

 

So, O'Sheas is able to sell them for $5/unit whereas dealers like Video 61 would lose tons of money on each cart.

967895[/snapback]

 

Hanging onto a dream that some day they'll all be worth hundreds of dollars because of the antiques roadshow?

 

Surely they must realize they are not going to move much, if any at all, with prices like that. I could see paying a little more than O'sheas on something you still needed if you were shoping for one of their repos. But damn $20 a pop, when they are all over ebay now, and O'sheas, that just doesn't make sense to me.

 

You should be able to cut some prices, even if you are loosing your shirts over what they originally cost 15 years ago, to make some money here in today. Tax write-off?

[Harry_Dodgson]

Ignoring the digression...

 

In your opinions, what should be the price for a new 7800 homebrew cartridge?

[Danno]

Ignoring the digression...

 

In your opinions, what should be the price for a new 7800 homebrew cartridge?

967923[/snapback]

 

$29.95 for the Actual Cart.

 

ROM download for free, to try it out first. No different than renting a current game before you buy it, or trying it in the store.

 

Regardless of videogame system/platform, Atari, Sega, Nintendo, PS1/2 - there's nothing worse than dropping $30 to $60 dollars on a game that sucks ass, with no return policy. But - there's also nothing better than to get a new game you can't put down either.

[Brad2600]

I would say a fair price would be $30-$35. After all, the people who make these games usually aren't in it for the profit so they do need to be compensated somehow.

 

As for regular 7800 games, I would never pay more than $15/apiece for boxed and $5/apiece for loose.

[jaybird3rd]

Ignoring the digression...

 

In your opinions, what should be the price for a new 7800 homebrew cartridge?

967923[/snapback]

I think $39.95 is entirely reasonable considering how difficult it is to produce these games and how few people are attempting to distribute new 7800 titles on cartridge. Everybody seems to be selling new 2600 cartridge parts now, but as far as I know 7800 cartridges still require either building a custom board or retrofitting old carts with a new ROM, both of which are expensive options. Plus, it's exciting to see a new 7800 game from one of the original developers (who supported the 7800 during its woefully short lifespan), so I'd buy it even if it cost a little more.

[Cybergoth]

Hi there!

 

Plus, it's exciting to see a new 7800 game from one of the original developers (who supported the 7800 during its woefully short lifespan), so I'd buy it even if it cost a little more.

 

Uihjha, wow! Who wrote it then?

 

Greetings,

Manuel

[jaybird3rd]

Uihjha, wow! Who wrote it then?

967985[/snapback]

Uhh ... Harry Dodgson wrote it. He also developed the 7800 monitor cartridge, which was an authorized release during the 7800's life. This makes him one of the original developers as opposed to someone coming to the 7800 after its death, which was all I meant in my post.

Edited November 18, 2005 by jaybird3rd

[Cybergoth]

Hi there!

 

Aha, I see. Just hoped someone from GCC resurfaced

 

Greetings,

Manuel

[jaybird3rd]

Okay, sorry for the confusion. Should have made myself clearer.

 

Just hoped someone from GCC resurfaced

967992[/snapback]

A new 7800 game from the GCC guys ... now THAT would be a must-have regardless of how much it cost!

Edited November 18, 2005 by jaybird3rd

[Harry_Dodgson]

Uihjha, wow! Who wrote it then?

967985[/snapback]

Uhh ... Harry Dodgson wrote it. He also developed the 7800 monitor cartridge, which was an authorized release during the 7800's life. This makes him one of the original developers as opposed to someone coming to the 7800 after its death, which was all I meant in my post.

967990[/snapback]

 

Who's that? I've never heard of him.

 

 

ROM download for free, to try it out first. No different than renting a current game before you buy it, or trying it in the store.

 

Tell that to the RIAA and the MPAA.

[EricBall]

$29.95 for the Actual Cart.

 

ROM download for free, to try it out first. No different than renting a current game before you buy it, or trying it in the store.

967974[/snapback]

Price needs to include:

- cost of any materials (PCBs, EPROMs, sacrificial donor carts)

- amortized cost of any one time costs (EPROM burner)

- amortized cost of any one time labour (PCB layout)

- manufacturing labour

- author royalties

- profit / risk factor

 

Lowering the price may generate more sales, but there's a break-even point on the amortized costs. Don't sell enough and you don't cover those costs & lose money. Of course, higher prices could also drop the number of sales even farther.

 

The real question is how big is the market for a 7800 homebrew and what people are willing to pay for it. $20-$40 isn't a lot in the grand scheme of things, and I'm sure there are completist collectors who would pay a lot more than that.

 

As for making Combat 7800 available for download, that is a decision I will leave for Harry to make. And since the ROM doesn't seem to be widely available, I will take that as an indication that Harry doesn't wish to make it available for download. And I respect his decision, just like Ebivision has made that decision. And, that may even be the correct decision to increase the number of cartridge sales.

 

Look, there's two ways to do this. I made the decision to make my creations freely available for download. If AtariAge or PackRat Video Games (or anyone else, for that matter), wants to make cartridges for sales, that's fine with me too (although I do expect royalties). But I'm not taking any risks; I'm not out any cash if they don't sell.

 

The other way (which makes particular sense for Combat 7800, since it's a new, untested, market), is to not make the ROM available for download and hope that will increase the number of sales. Let's face it. We can talk about try before you buy, etc, but when it comes down to it, often people will not pay for something when there is a free equivalent.

 

We can also turn this on it's head. If you want 7800 homebrews on a cartridge, like Frogger, Q*Bert & Beef Drop, then you damn well better pay Harry his asking price for Combat 7800. Because the AtariAge store (and atarisales) aren't in business to make you happy. They are in business to make a profit. And the more Combat 7800 cartridges atarisales sells, the more incentive there is for them and others to release other 7800 homebrews.

 

Hmm, that was rather longer than I expected. I'll get off this soapbox now.

[Shawn]

$20 - $25 I think is a good price for a new game for the 2600 or 7800, well, thats all my cheap ass would pay anyhow

[Danno]

ROM download for free, to try it out first. No different than renting a current game before you buy it, or trying it in the store.

 

Tell that to the RIAA and the MPAA.

968014[/snapback]

 

I'm a full time musician, ASCAP & BMI published, on a medium sized record label.

 

We post sample versions of all of our new music for FREE in MP3 format on our website before it's CD release. In fact - MOST professional musicians do.

 

At the very least, you should post a limited version, maybe one that has a timer that ends the game before you're done.

[Danno]

$29.95 for the Actual Cart.

 

ROM download for free, to try it out first. No different than renting a current game before you buy it, or trying it in the store.

967974[/snapback]

Price needs to include:

- cost of any materials (PCBs, EPROMs, sacrificial donor carts)

- amortized cost of any one time costs (EPROM burner)

- amortized cost of any one time labour (PCB layout)

- manufacturing labour

- author royalties

- profit / risk factor

Of course, that is to be expected.

 

Lowering the price may generate more sales, but there's a break-even point on the amortized costs.  Don't sell enough and you don't cover those costs & lose money. Of course, higher prices could also drop the number of sales even farther.

Don't sell enough at the higher price, and you still run the risk of losing money on the costs. In fact - one could argue that the higher the price, the higher the risk, especially in sucha small niche market of classic gamers with a very little-known system like the 7800.

 

The real question is how big is the market for a 7800 homebrew and what people are willing to pay for it.  $20-$40 isn't a lot in the grand scheme of things, and I'm sure there are completist collectors who would pay a lot more than that.

Can't argue with that. If $39.95 covers the costs better, so be it. It's not unreasonable.

 

As for making Combat 7800 available for download, that is a decision I will leave for Harry to make.  And since the ROM doesn't seem to be widely available, I will take that as an indication that Harry doesn't wish to make it available for download.  And I respect his decision, just like Ebivision has made that decision.  And, that may even be the correct decision to increase the number of cartridge sales.

It might increase sales, true. It might also increase specualtion that the game just plain isn't very good and conversely decrease sales. Since I've never seen a single screenshot, working avi, etc, I can't say one way or the other. That's the point. I'm not too excited with plunking down $40.00 for something I haven't seen in action. I wouldn't do it on a store bouoght game for any other system.

 

Look, there's two ways to do this.  I made the decision to make my creations freely available for download.  If AtariAge or PackRat Video Games (or anyone else, for that matter), wants to make cartridges for sales, that's fine with me too (although I do expect royalties).  But I'm not taking any risks; I'm not out any cash if they don't sell.

Probably a smart call.

 

The other way (which makes particular sense for Combat 7800, since it's a new, untested, market), is to not make the ROM available for download and hope that will increase the number of sales.  Let's face it.  We can talk about try before you buy, etc, but when it comes down to it, often people will not pay for something when there is a free equivalent.

Actually - despite what Lars Ulrich and the RIAA gestapo like to feign, record sales for the most highly downloaded Albums by major recording artists have stayed the same or increased. What the Record Companies and Movie Studios have seen is a downtick in sales of some of their "subpar" efforts. People download a CD/Movie that isn't so great and decide not to buy it.

 

So you can make the argument, is it the uploader's fault? - or the artist/producer's fault for offering a less than satisfactory product?

 

We can also turn this on it's head.  If you want 7800 homebrews on a cartridge, like Frogger, Q*Bert & Beef Drop, then you damn well better pay Harry his asking price for Combat 7800.  Because the AtariAge store (and atarisales) aren't in business to make you happy.  They are in business to make a profit.  And the more Combat 7800 cartridges atarisales sells, the more incentive there is for them and others to release other 7800 homebrews.

 

I would willingly buy EVERY single one of those on cart when they are offered. Mostly because I know what they are like from testing the earlier versions myself as they were posted WIP right here at AA.

 

Hmm, that was rather longer than I expected.  I'll get off this soapbox now.

968018[/snapback]

 

Everyone is entitled to soapbox. I'm sure Harry appreciates this feedback, even if it isn't the answers he was hoping for.

[Harry_Dodgson]

Everyone is entitled to soapbox. I'm sure Harry appreciates this feedback, even if it isn't the answers he was hoping for.

 

Actually, I didn't know what to expect from this forum. I got troll'ed when I mentioned that I preferred A800 Ballblazer to the 7800 version.

 

It might increase sales, true. It might also increase specualtion that the game just plain isn't very good and conversely decrease sales. Since I've never seen a single screenshot, working avi, etc, I can't say one way or the other. That's the point. I'm not too excited with plunking down $40.00 for something I haven't seen in action. I wouldn't do it on a store bouoght game for any other system.

 

I could put my CVS (not) one-time camcoder in front of a screen and make a movie of the game in action, but I don't have anywhere to host that large of a file (about 4MB/minute).

[Danno]

Everyone is entitled to soapbox. I'm sure Harry appreciates this feedback, even if it isn't the answers he was hoping for.

 

Actually, I didn't know what to expect from this forum. I got troll'ed when I mentioned that I preferred A800 Ballblazer to the 7800 version.

 

It might increase sales, true. It might also increase specualtion that the game just plain isn't very good and conversely decrease sales. Since I've never seen a single screenshot, working avi, etc, I can't say one way or the other. That's the point. I'm not too excited with plunking down $40.00 for something I haven't seen in action. I wouldn't do it on a store bouoght game for any other system.

 

I could put my CVS (not) one-time camcoder in front of a screen and make a movie of the game in action, but I don't have anywhere to host that large of a file (about 4MB/minute).

968038[/snapback]

 

Or you could fire it up on an older version of M.E.S.S. that records the output to an avi file.

 

Or just post some screen shots.

[Harry_Dodgson]

Everyone is entitled to soapbox. I'm sure Harry appreciates this feedback, even if it isn't the answers he was hoping for.

 

Actually, I didn't know what to expect from this forum. I got troll'ed when I mentioned that I preferred A800 Ballblazer to the 7800 version.

 

It might increase sales, true. It might also increase specualtion that the game just plain isn't very good and conversely decrease sales. Since I've never seen a single screenshot, working avi, etc, I can't say one way or the other. That's the point. I'm not too excited with plunking down $40.00 for something I haven't seen in action. I wouldn't do it on a store bouoght game for any other system.

 

I could put my CVS (not) one-time camcoder in front of a screen and make a movie of the game in action, but I don't have anywhere to host that large of a file (about 4MB/minute).

968038[/snapback]

 

Or you could fire it up on an older version of M.E.S.S. that records the output to an avi file.

 

Or just post some screen shots.

968040[/snapback]

 

I never could get MESS to work on any OS. I developed/playtested this game using Steem and V7800 under Windblows 98. I would have done it on my Stacy4, but the backlight is almost dead.

 

The link to the screenshots is up there at post #5

[MaDDuck]

So....................

Getting back to the point!

 

Is Combat 1990 just two player or is there a 1 player game?

Does it have a label on the front & end?

Any POKEY sound, or just TIA?

 

Has anyonbe hear played it, is it fun???

 

I just blew $49.99 for a new Pokemon game (Pokemon XD: Gale of Darkness) so I think $39.99 is still within a decent price range for collectors, but I PLAY my games, has to be fun to be worth it!

Edited November 18, 2005 by MaDDuck

[FireTiger]

How about a reduced price for tow or three people who do reviews, if they love it or at least like it I'll get one or if it gets good reviews here.

 

I'm not exactly sure how this cart improves combat.

 

Can you tell us about each of the game selects?

 

Do you have reverse gear?

 

two types of shot: Ltbtn = straight shot, rtbtn = pong shot ?

 

Can the jets/plains now do something cool?

 

Are they (jets) included?

 

How about joust like helicopters too?

 

Did you put in any boat leves?

 

Are there power ups?

 

I must know these things.