R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 Hello, I went through all of my dumps from AA and elsewhere and found these games that seem original and need NTSC conversion. I used clonespy and found a few that were mislabeled as PAL when they seemed NTSC compatible. They may be PAL-M, though, I can't tell this other that the number of scanlines that Z26 shows. What is the maximum number of lines before the average TV will roll? I see some of Thomas' great conversions at 282, and a couple of titles listed as NTSC seem to show 290+. If there is a known NTSC version of any of these, let me know, as I am going to try my hand at converting them where possible. Boing! (First Star) My Golf (HES) Mission 3000 AD (Bitcorp) Mission Survive (Video Gems) Motocross (Starsoft) Ski Hunt (Homevision) Ski Run (Funvision) - Pete Rittwage http://rittwage.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 I found an NTSC Boing, so that can be crossed off. -Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 My Golf & Mission Survive have both been converted by Thomas Jentzsch. http://www.atariage.com/software_conversions.html I found a rom of Mission 3000 with 264 lines in my rom files. I don't think it was converted recently. More likely a Brazilian pirate. Mission_3000.bin Some people seem to have trouble with Desert Falcon rolling on their tvs. It has 281 lines. Most of TJ's conversions are below that. 280 lines is getting into a grey area between NTSC 262 and PAL 312. The minimum line count for PAL is 284. Other notables: -Air Raid (290 Lines) It's likely this is PAL. A few people are rumoured to have an NTSC version, but no one has dumped it yet. -Dumbo's Flying Circus (Prototype 286 Lines) -Great Escape (288 Lines) -King Kong (292 Lines) I think this is PAL. IIRC the NTSC version has not been dumped, because of problems with the format of the cart. -RealSports Basketball (Prototype 290 Lines) TJ also converted the PAL version of this. -Zoofun (291 Lines) I don't know what to make off this. Odd lines = no color in PAL format, but it's a really high line count. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 (edited) R. Cade, Ski Run is not from Funvision. It's a Rainbow Vision title (or a Taiwan R.O.C. title). The name StarSoft is equal to $#!*@^!%$@#+$&$%*^%$, because it doesn't exist. Somebody came up with this name, because he didn't have a clue. Please delete that name from your memory for now and forever. All the ROMS you mentioned exist in NTSC format, except for Motocross and Ski Hunt. Edited December 21, 2005 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 Other notables: -Air Raid (290 Lines) It's likely this is PAL. A few people are rumoured to have an NTSC version, but no one has dumped it yet. -Dumbo's Flying Circus (Prototype 286 Lines) -Great Escape (288 Lines) -King Kong (292 Lines) I think this is PAL. IIRC the NTSC version has not been dumped, because of problems with the format of the cart. -RealSports Basketball (Prototype 290 Lines) TJ also converted the PAL version of this. -Zoofun (291 Lines) I don't know what to make off this. Odd lines = no color in PAL format, but it's a really high line count. 986477[/snapback] Strange- there are 2 existing roms of King Kong. One is 312 lines and the other is ~290. I figured maybe one was NTSC, but that's a bit too many lines. Can someone with a Cuttle try out a few of the 290 line games and see if they work in NTSC? -Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Great Hierophant Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 Some people seem to have trouble with Desert Falcon rolling on their tvs. It has 281 lines. Most of TJ's conversions are below that. 280 lines is getting into a grey area between NTSC 262 and PAL 312. The minimum line count for PAL is 284. This is the test I use to distinguish NTSC from PAL games because I know my TV will roll with a native PAL video source. I assume that Fatal Run (and any other PAL only games) in the FB2 is a conversion or an NTSC prototype. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 OK, so I have: Air Raid - 290 lines Dumbo's Flying Circus - 286 lines (307 during reset) Great Escape - 288 lines King Kong - 292 lines (another dump has 312) Motocross - 324 lines (another dump has 332 (!) with diff colors Ski Hunt - 296 lines Ski Run - 308 lines Words (Sancho) - 316 lines Zoo Fun - 291 lines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 A NTSC Ski Run ROM exists (267 scanlines). BTW: Its Words-Attack, instead of Words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 I got Air Raid down to 276 lines, but no way to test on the real thing at the moment. I need to pick up a Supercharger or a new 7800, I guess. What a crap game, though. airtest.bin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 Farmyard Fun appears to be 281 lines, while Tom's Eierjagd (same game) is 312. So I guess this is NTSC also... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 You're really Gun Ho on this, eh Pete? Even though people complain about Desert Falcon rolling it works fine on my tv. I have no idea about the rest I listed, but they do have a higher scan count. Air Raid (276 lines) played fine in Z26. I don't have the means to test it on real hardware either. What a crap game, though.986759[/snapback] LOL it shares some code with Space Jockey. So there is a King Kong with 312 lines. Maybe the rom with 292 lines is supposed to be NTSC. Anyone have more info? Could someone please post or send me the NTSC Ski Run rom? Finally some people have trouble with Artillery Duel rolling on there tvs as well. The problem here is not that there is too many scanlines, but too few! Most of the Artillery Duels carts you find have the rom with 240 lines. Here's the second rom that has 258 lines. I'm curious how many lines the PAL rom holds. Anyone know? Artillery_Duel__258_Lines_.bin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 You're really Gun Ho on this, eh Pete? Even though people complain about Desert Falcon rolling it works fine on my tv. I have no idea about the rest I listed, but they do have a higher scan count. Air Raid (276 lines) played fine in Z26. I don't have the means to test it on real hardware either. What a crap game, though.986759[/snapback] LOL it shares some code with Space Jockey. So there is a King Kong with 312 lines. Maybe the rom with 292 lines is supposed to be NTSC. Anyone have more info? Could someone please post or send me the NTSC Ski Run rom? Finally some people have trouble with Artillery Duel rolling on there tvs as well. The problem here is not that there is too many scanlines, but too few! Most of the Artillery Duels carts you find have the rom with 240 lines. Here's the second rom that has 258 lines. I'm curious how many lines the PAL rom holds. Anyone know? Artillery_Duel__258_Lines_.bin 986802[/snapback] Yeah, that's a strange one. The "PAL" version has 261 and the colors are correct when played on NTSC (the "real" NTSC one has mucked up colors). I have Ski Hunt almost converted. I have it at 280 lines, but am still finding all the color tables now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 (edited) I've got Ski Hunt converted, but the colors are funny. I've fixed the obvious ones, such as the skier and the sky, but the way it draws tree colors in foreign to me. What does the LDA.wy here do? ; weird routine for line coloring LDY $d7 LDA.wy $0096,Y ;4 TAY ;2 LDA.wy $009F,Y ;4 STA $A3 ;3 LDA.wy $00CD,Y ;4 STA $A5 ;3 LDA.wy $0093,Y ;4 STA $D8 ;3 STA WSYNC ;3 STA HMOVE ;3 $A5 is the offset of the color of the trees, but how is it deriving this? It later does this. ; color of trees, rocks LDA ($A5),Y ;5 STA COLUP0 ;3 Y starts at 0 in that loop and is the current line of the obstacle being drawn, I believe. If I force this second part to just draw green, the trees turn back to pink while passing on the same line as the skier. (I know 6502 pretty well, but just getting into 2600 programming) skihunt_ntsc.bin skihunt.asm.txt Edited December 21, 2005 by R.Cade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 Here is a 265-line version of King Kong. I did not fix the colors because they really weren't offensive. kingkong_ntsc.bin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 I think the colors are better now. Who the hell really wants a flamboyant pink screen to climb anyhow? I must say though I like the colors better for the people in the original. I'm not sure if you can do anything about that. This is really good work so far Pete. I'm sure someone will try your conversions on real hardware soon. With your question about Ski Hunt... well there are plenty of good people on here with a wealth of experience in programming a 2600. Thomas Jentzsch has done many conversions so why not ask him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 Rom, has Clown Downtown ever been converted to NTSC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 I figured out how it derives the color. When Y > 0 it gets a color from $CE and uses the colors after that from the palette, one after the other. In the PAL TIA palette, there is a section where there is a gradient of green, then a gradient of grey, which this takes advantage of ($1A offset). NTSC doesn't have that, so the best I could do is green trees with a blue shadow. I also can make them rainbow-colored (flashing) or look like Christmas trees, but.. well. Pete skihunt_ntsc.bin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 Rom, has Clown Downtown ever been converted to NTSC? 986964[/snapback] It's called "Walker". I have it somewhere. I think you can download it from this site? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 walker.bin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 (edited) Rom, has Clown Downtown ever been converted to NTSC? 986964[/snapback] It's called "Walker". I have it somewhere. I think you can download it from this site? 986983[/snapback] Edit: LOL I just hit the submit button by mistake. Nope, it's not listed on this site, but CPUWIZ has got all the bases covered. Here are two screenshots of Ski Hunt. The first is Pal, the second the NTSC conversion. It doesn't look to bad to me. IIRC Thomas had to rewrite code for almost every game to get the colors right. Edited December 21, 2005 by Omegamatrix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uosipa llamxew Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 I got Air Raid down to 276 lines, but no way to test on the real thing at the moment. I need to pick up a Supercharger or a new 7800, I guess. What a crap game, though. 986759[/snapback] I tried the ROM on real hardware via my Krokocart. It works great! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 I got Air Raid down to 276 lines, but no way to test on the real thing at the moment. I need to pick up a Supercharger or a new 7800, I guess. What a crap game, though. 986759[/snapback] I tried the ROM on real hardware via my Krokocart. It works great! 987000[/snapback] Mojofltr, I'm curious if you have ever tried the original rom on your Krokodile Cart to see what it does. If you had a tv that for sure rolled with PAL carts it would be even better. I know one of my tvs rolls, and the other doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted December 22, 2005 Author Share Posted December 22, 2005 Rom, has Clown Downtown ever been converted to NTSC? 986964[/snapback] It's called "Walker". I have it somewhere. I think you can download it from this site? 986983[/snapback] Edit: LOL I just hit the submit button by mistake. Nope, it's not listed on this site, but CPUWIZ has got all the bases covered. Here are two screenshots of Ski Hunt. The first is Pal, the second the NTSC conversion. It doesn't look to bad to me. IIRC Thomas had to rewrite code for almost every game to get the colors right. 986995[/snapback] I was going to fix the mountains also, but they're not offensive the way they are. They are just basically in a different order. The code has comments on where those colors are referenced. The mountains are in one place, clouds in another, and the base color in a third place. You have to change the base if you change the mountains, or else it looks funny. Dig the pink mountains on other variations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uosipa llamxew Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 (edited) Mojofltr, I'm curious if you have ever tried the original rom on your Krokodile Cart to see what it does. If you had a tv that for sure rolled with PAL carts it would be even better. I know one of my tvs rolls, and the other doesn't. I haven't tried the original rom, but I will right now. My tv does roll with PAL carts. //edit// I just tried the original ROM and it runs fine too. I've tried many PAL ROMs on my Krokocart and Supercharger and they all rolled. Weird. Edited December 22, 2005 by mojofltr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Wonder007 Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 (edited) OK, so I have: Air Raid - 290 lines Dumbo's Flying Circus - 286 lines (307 during reset) Great Escape - 288 lines King Kong - 292 lines (another dump has 312) Motocross - 324 lines (another dump has 332 (!) with diff colors Ski Hunt - 296 lines Ski Run - 308 lines Words (Sancho) - 316 lines Zoo Fun - 291 lines 986739[/snapback] My Air Raid and Dumbo proto work perfectly on my NTSC television set. Edited December 22, 2005 by Wonder007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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