atarimac Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 All, I've created a new Mac/Atari program, in addition to my Atari800MacX emulator. It's called Sio2OSX, and here is the blurb from it's web page, http://members.cox.net/atarimac/Sio2OSX.html: Sio2OSX is a peripheral emulator for the Atari 8-bit computers that allows the Atari computer to use an OSX based Macintosh as a disk drive, a cassette drive, and a printer. Sio2OSX peforms functions similar to APE or SIO2PC on Windows based computers. Sio2OSX is a shareware program, and must be registered for full operation. The unregistered version of the program will run for 5 minutes before quiting, allowing you to verify operation with your hardware setup before purchase. The software can be easily registered for $24.99 through Kagi. A full manual is included within the application's Help menu. Note, as this does require serial USB hardware, and is a new product, please try it out on your hardware before you pay the registration fee. I'll be glad to answer any questions you might have by email. Requirements are 10.2 or later, and a PPC Mac, as well as a FTDI based USB Serial adapter and a SIO2PC Hardware cable. Details are on the web site about the USB adapter and SIO2PC cable. Thanks, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted January 20, 2006 Author Share Posted January 20, 2006 Sorry, a colon got included in the Web site link, here's one without it: http://members.cox.net/atarimac/Sio2OSX.html Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Allan Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Hey Mark, Nice work. I can't wait to try it out. One less reason to drag out my PC. Now if someone would just write a 7800/5200 disassembler and software to run my eprom burner. Allan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_bernstein Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 (edited) Mark, This is wonderful news ! For seven years, I've been waiting for something like this to come to the Mac. Eventually, I thought we would have to wait for the Mac Intel line to offer double boot but, thanks to you, this is not necessary anymore. On the behalf of all the Mac users surfing this forum, a huge thank you. (other mac users are welcome to say thank you as well !). I'll order the USB to Serial cable adapter right away and will keep you posted on how compatible with my current Macintosh (Dual G4 1.25Ghz DMM 2003 running 10.3.9) the whole operation is. Cheers ! AB. Edited January 22, 2006 by andy_bernstein Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted January 21, 2006 Author Share Posted January 21, 2006 I'm glad some people are interested in using SIO2PC on the Mac. I thought I might give some technical details here as to why only an FTDI serial adapter will work. SIO2PC cables use modem control lines to do the Atari SIO bus command signaling. They either use RI, DSR, or RTS. With a hardwired serial port of the type on PC's (Although not all newer ones, they are showing up without serial ports now as well), software is able to read the state of these lines quickly. However, with USB Serial adapters, the software is subject to the delays of the USB bus. For SIO2PC applications, by the time the software finds out about a state change in the Modem control lines, it is too late, and the data it wants to look at (the command itself) is already gone. The FTDI USB adapters work differently, in that every time any data is received, the state of the modem control lines is sent with it, so that the state change and the command arrive at the same time. So that is why FTDI is the only serial adapter that works, and believe me I tried a bunch. (and I've written USB Serial adapater drivers as part of my daytime job ). One other option is that in looking in the drivers in Mac OSX, there is actually a 16550 Serial port driver. This may mean that you could use a PC PCI Serial card with 16550 Serial chips on it in a Mac. I looked long and hard, and didn't find anyone on the web doing this, but I always thought it would be interesting to try. Of course, it would only be for tower machines (Laptop users would be left out), and new machines with only PCI X might be left out as well. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 I’m not a Mac user, but I find this extremely interesting. Can you comment a bit more on the technical details. For example, I have some questions: Are you sure that FTDI based adapters are the only ones that attach modem status to incoming bytes? I guess that some adapters might have a hardware limitation, but I’d suppose that in many others is an issue of drivers, and not hardware. Are packets time-stamped? I found that for copy-protected disks, accurate timing is extremely important. And the USB latency might represent a problem. Actually, in modern non-real time OSes, the latency of the OS itself could kill you even more than the hardware one. Can you recommend actual end-user products (just looked in the FTDI web page and it seems they only sell chips)? Do you know if different final products offer different features at the driver/programmer level? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted January 21, 2006 Author Share Posted January 21, 2006 Are you sure that FTDI based adapters are the only ones that attach modem status to incoming bytes? I guess that some adapters might have a hardware limitation, but I’d suppose that in many others is an issue of drivers, and not hardware. They are the only one of the type that I have run across. I'm a consultant for a embedded software company in my daytime job, and it is the only one that I have seen like that, not that there may not be others. Many of the common ones you can buy in retail stores today are based on the Prolific chipset, which does not do this. The issue isn't a physical hardware limitation, but is in the format of the received data, which is normally on a USB Bulk Input pipe. With FTDI, the first two bytes of every bulk input are the status of the control lines, where other adapters, you have to send a seperate USB vendor specific command to retrieve the status. Are packets time-stamped? I found that for copy-protected disks, accurate timing is extremely important. And the USB latency might represent a problem. Actually, in modern non-real time OSes, the latency of the OS itself could kill you even more than the hardware one. The packets aren't time stamped. So you are right, jitter and latency could cause a problem if they are important. And you are correct about OS latency. Although the Mac OSX Mach kernel scheduler seems to do a good job of keeping that to a minimum when I assigned the thread that is processing the serial data a high priority. But then, this version of SIO2OSX doesn't include any copy protection duplication schemes, such as your libraries provide, so I haven't had to worry about that yet. Can you recommend actual end-user products (just looked in the FTDI web page and it seems they only sell chips)? Do you know if different final products offer different features at the driver/programmer level? The best source I've found is here, http://www.usbgear.com/computer_cable_deta...06%2C1009%2C601 . USB Gear caries several adapters using FTDI chips. FTDI's support has been helpful and responsive, so they might be able to recommend other sources. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 I'm a Mac user that only kept a IBM based PC for APE. This is fabulous news. I will probably register soon. I was not sure, after reading if this has the ability to use the internet like the regular APE does. Does it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted January 21, 2006 Author Share Posted January 21, 2006 I was not sure, after reading if this has the ability to use the internet like the regular APE does. Does it? Currently, Sio2OSX doesn't have any support for R: emulation or internet use. It might be added in a future version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 This is great! Now I have yet another reason to finally order a USB Serial adapter for my Macs. I'll try the USB Gear link above and order one.. I ordered one from Buy.com a long time ago, but for some reason they never shipped it (and I didn't follow up). Keep up the great work! [Edit: Order placed! Now I just need an ADB to USB adapter so I can use an Apple Extended II keyboard!!] ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted January 22, 2006 Share Posted January 22, 2006 I was not sure, after reading if this has the ability to use the internet like the regular APE does. Does it? Currently, Sio2OSX doesn't have any support for R: emulation or internet use. It might be added in a future version. 1004270[/snapback] I went ahead and bought this though I hadn't gotten it working yet. I appreciate the effort. Try to add the R handlers in the future please. Thanks again for the Mac version. I now no longer need a IBM type computer for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 BTW, the developer encourages that people get the SIO2OSX working before buying. I have always said I would supoprt anyone that supported SIO2PC on the Mac, so why I went ahead and paid for it. So far all adaptors with my SIO2PC cable are not working, so I ordered the USB to serial interface as suggested on the site. The actual program and it's interface looks quite nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 So far all adaptors with my SIO2PC cable are not working, so I ordered the USB to serial interface as suggested on the site. Yes, doctorclu is correct, all of the adapters I tried during development except for FTDI based ones failed. These includes ones with chipsets by Prolific (most of the ones you find at CompUSA, etc. nowadays), Keyspan, Belkin, etc. The other reason I warned about registering was issues with drivers on the FTDI. I never had any issues on my hardware, but one of by Beta testers did, and was fixed by a different version of the FTDI driver. So please email me at atarimac@cox.net if you have the same issues. For reference I have a Dual 1.25GHz G4 MDD, running 10.4.4, and a B/W G3 500MHz running 10.2, and have tested on both. It has also been tested on a G5 tower and a laptop. Thanks, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 So far all adaptors with my SIO2PC cable are not working, so I ordered the USB to serial interface as suggested on the site. Yes, doctorclu is correct, all of the adapters I tried during development except for FTDI based ones failed. These includes ones with chipsets by Prolific (most of the ones you find at CompUSA, etc. nowadays), Keyspan, Belkin, etc. The other reason I warned about registering was issues with drivers on the FTDI. I never had any issues on my hardware, but one of by Beta testers did, and was fixed by a different version of the FTDI driver. So please email me at atarimac@cox.net if you have the same issues. For reference I have a Dual 1.25GHz G4 MDD, running 10.4.4, and a B/W G3 500MHz running 10.2, and have tested on both. It has also been tested on a G5 tower and a laptop. Thanks, Mark 1005365[/snapback] Thanks! Will let you know in a few days when the adaptor arrives. So while we're here, have you looked into what it would take to add the R: handlers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 Got my USB to serial adaptor that was suggested on the site, driver that came with it was not enough. Downloaded the updated driver on the site and the program worked great. Will test this further. As I mentioned, I said I would support the people that made a Mac version of the SIO2PC, so glad you made this possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted January 26, 2006 Share Posted January 26, 2006 Got my USB to serial adaptor that was suggested on the site, driver that came with it was not enough. Downloaded the updated driver on the site and the program worked great. 1007529[/snapback] I also received my adapter today, but, uhrr, I don't seem to have an SIO2PC adapter handy so I'm going to have to build one. I don't even have any SIO cables laying about, so I'm going to have to dig through boxes in my garage to see if I can find one to sacrifice. I'm quite eager to test this out! ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 Got my USB to serial adaptor that was suggested on the site, driver that came with it was not enough. Downloaded the updated driver on the site and the program worked great. doctorclu, I'm glad to hear the program is working for you. I also received my adapter today, but, uhrr, I don't seem to have an SIO2PC adapter handy so I'm going to have to build one. I don't even have any SIO cables laying about, so I'm going to have to dig through boxes in my garage to see if I can find one to sacrifice. I'm quite eager to test this out! Al, I'd lone you a cable, but I'm afraid the drive from Arizona to Texas is a long one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 I also received my adapter today, but, uhrr, I don't seem to have an SIO2PC adapter handy so I'm going to have to build one. I don't even have any SIO cables laying about, so I'm going to have to dig through boxes in my garage to see if I can find one to sacrifice. I'm quite eager to test this out! Al, I'd lone you a cable, but I'm afraid the drive from Arizona to Texas is a long one 1007788[/snapback] I used to sell these in the store (SIO2PC adapters with the cable attached) but long ago ran out of the cables. They were nice, as the cables only had one connector on them, so I wasn't sacrificing the finite number of normal SIO cables out there. Ahh well, sometimes such a sacrifice needs to be made! ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 I also received my adapter today, but, uhrr, I don't seem to have an SIO2PC adapter handy so I'm going to have to build one. I don't even have any SIO cables laying about, so I'm going to have to dig through boxes in my garage to see if I can find one to sacrifice. I'm quite eager to test this out! Al, I'd lone you a cable, but I'm afraid the drive from Arizona to Texas is a long one 1007788[/snapback] I used to sell these in the store (SIO2PC adapters with the cable attached) but long ago ran out of the cables. They were nice, as the cables only had one connector on them, so I wasn't sacrificing the finite number of normal SIO cables out there. Ahh well, sometimes such a sacrifice needs to be made! ..Al 1007799[/snapback] I got my SIO2PC cable from Jason Worley who I have no idea where he is now. The cable was simple, and actually is a SIO cable connected to a 25 pin serial cable joined together with a model that is wrapped in electrical tape. But it has worked great with (with adaptors) as I have worked with an Atari ST (800XLDJ... the strange SIO2PC solution for that machine), DosAPE and WinAPE on the IBM platformers, and finally SIO2OSX on the Macintosh. I keep wanting to hook up two Atari computers and connect them to one laptop with a serial switch. Maybe someday I will. In the meantime, I am currently transferring my images from my DosApe machine to my Mac laptop. Not to be a pest, but any chance this program could be ported to Os 9? I have some great spare Macs I could use for what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 All, For any of you who have version 1.0 of Sio2OSX, I realized tonight that I had screwed up and left the expiration timer that was in the Beta test vesions active in the real code. So all of the copies expired today. I have a new 1.1 version which as soon as Al posts it to the server, I will link from my web page. I've emailed it to the registered users, but if anyone else needs a copy before then, please email me..... Thanks, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 All, For any of you who have version 1.0 of Sio2OSX, I realized tonight that I had screwed up and left the expiration timer that was in the Beta test vesions active in the real code. So all of the copies expired today. I have a new 1.1 version which as soon as Al posts it to the server, I will link from my web page. I've emailed it to the registered users, but if anyone else needs a copy before then, please email me..... Thanks, Mark 1010524[/snapback] I've uploaded the new file, it's located here: http://www.atariage.com/800/emulation/down...OSX1.1.0.dmg.gz ..Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted November 18, 2006 Share Posted November 18, 2006 So checking in on this... any further plans thought about in this for the future? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted November 29, 2006 Author Share Posted November 29, 2006 So checking in on this... any further plans thought about in this for the future? I have a Universal Binary version ready for release, just waiting for Al to post it to the server. After that, I'm moving cross country, so it's going to be several months before I get a chance to work on it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oesii Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 I finally got an Intel Mac this fall so I would be interested in knowing when Al posts that Universal binary so I can try it out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrobits Posted January 8, 2007 Share Posted January 8, 2007 I tried the link for sio2osx 1.2 from atarimac.com and it points back here to atariage for the download source, but gives a file-not-found error. Has this actually been released yet? I'd love to give this a whirl on my new macbook... -retrobits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like us on Facebook
Follow us on Twitter
AtariAge on Instagram
Watch us on YouTube
Chat on Discord
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.