MausBoy Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 I'm almost done creating what I think is a cute virtual pet game for the VCS, the main thing I'm stuck on is the best way to save pets so they don't die when you turn off the system/emulator. Once that is worked out I want to incorporate a training/battle system so that people can put their pets up against each other in a two player game. If I could get carts made, every cart could have it's own one of a kind pet, which I think would make each cart somewhat more interesting to own since it's completely unique. I realize these are pure novelty but I think I the game aspects really are fun. I don't even know if it's possible to finish this or how long it would take, but the question is: Which classic VCS "creatures" would you like to see featured as VCS-Pets? oh, and what is the best way to save game states on the vcs? I would need to be able to load two plus the battle game onto one cart, possibly the CC. The supercharger would work too but not many people have any of the options that I know of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmips Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 http://www.vectrex.biz/memcard.htm Programming information - It's the i2c section http://www.atariage.com/store/misc/atarivox.zip There are also others who have supported the memcard like VDUB_BOBBY and info on the stella list. Richard H keeps a master list somewhere of the block assignments. Stratogems supports memcard. (GOOD IDEA BTW! I'm glad someone's finally going through with this) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 (edited) Great Idea! I'd Like to Help! Here Are All The 2600 Creatures I Can Think Of... ( I Know Some of theese Are Childesh Or Not Really Cute...) Big Bird - From Big Birds Egg Catch Bugs Bunny - From Bugs Bunny Dog - From Chase The ChuckWagon Cookie Monster - From Cookie Monster Munch Dragon - From Adventure Garfield - From Garfield Grover - Grovers Music Maker Turtle - from Mario Bros Kermit The Frog - From Miss Piggy's Wedding Pac-Man - From Pac-Man Ghost - From Ms.Pac-Man Rabbit - From Rabbit Transit Canibal - From Jungle hunt Smart Seymour - From Peek-A-Boo Frogger - From Frogger Mole - From Holey Moley Pig - from Oink! Wolf - from Oink! Q-Bert - From Q-Bert Centipede - From Centipede Alligators - From Jungle Hunt Edited May 16, 2006 by Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard H. Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 Richard H keeps a master list somewhere of the block assignments. It's here Let me know if you want to reserve some space. PM me your address, and I'll send you a complimentary MemCard to experiment with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gateway Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 I believe Chris Cracknell started a 2600 Virtual pet program back in the early homebrew days( 1995-2000 ), but I don't think he went very far with it. I have the ROM around here somewhere... Or you can find it in the Stella list archives. Yes, this would be a fun idea! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 Do You Like My Creature Ideas? Also I Think VCS-Pets Would Be A Great Title! Also How Many Creatures Are you Thinking Of Per Cartridge Are you Thinking Of Including? Or Are Going One Creature Per Cart Style? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+batari Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 I'm almost done creating what I think is a cute virtual pet game for the VCS, the main thing I'm stuck on is the best way to save pets so they don't die when you turn off the system/emulator. Once that is worked out I want to incorporate a training/battle system so that people can put their pets up against each other in a two player game. If I could get carts made, every cart could have it's own one of a kind pet, which I think would make each cart somewhat more interesting to own since it's completely unique. I realize these are pure novelty but I think I the game aspects really are fun. I don't even know if it's possible to finish this or how long it would take, but the question is: Which classic VCS "creatures" would you like to see featured as VCS-Pets? oh, and what is the best way to save game states on the vcs? I would need to be able to load two plus the battle game onto one cart, possibly the CC. The supercharger would work too but not many people have any of the options that I know of. In an emulator, you can save the state. In real hardware, yes, the memcard is the best way, and bB support is planned. When completed, it will save or restore the entire state of the game in progress in a single command. The memcard support was a little mired by (some ridiculous) protocol suggestions, but I think we came to a consensus (or an impasse, I can't remember which.) Now it's mostly a matter of me getting around to actually writing the code. I have a memcard, but I've not written the code yet, for no good reason but laziness and a lack of requests (until now.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gateway Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 I found it( not sure if this was the latest version ). AFAIK, Chris "Crackers" Cracknell left the scene a long time ago, but I've attached his virtual pet demo and some screeshots from z26 as a reference for comparison. Use joystick left or right to "evolve" the pet, up and down to change the "tool" I guess. I have no idea what each object was to be, but it's a fun demo to play with. I don't think anything like the MemCard was available back in 1997, maybe that is why Chris didn't develop this further? I am sure you can come up with something better and fun, as long as it ain't too similar to PokeMon's "Gotta catch'em all" or whatever the phrase is. v_pet007.bin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feralstorm Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 Virtual Yar!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari-Jess Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 I am sure you can come up with something better and fun, as long as it ain't too similar to PokeMon's "Gotta catch'em all" or whatever the phrase is. Once they got to about 386 of em (more now and more to come) they stopped using that as a catch phrase. Mostly because you couldn't catch them all when the games moved to the GBA. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 I found it( not sure if this was the latest version ).AFAIK it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MausBoy Posted May 17, 2006 Author Share Posted May 17, 2006 (edited) Richard H keeps a master list somewhere of the block assignments.Stratogems supports memcard. (GOOD IDEA BTW! I'm glad someone's finally going through with this) This is exactly what I needed to be able to save the state of the vp, but it will require the serial transfer interface to load two pets for the battle game. Plus I want to release a 4 player tournament cart in the future. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction, and I'm glad you like the idea. I didn't know anyone else had tried when I started playing with the idea. Do You Like My Creature Ideas?Also I Think VCS-Pets Would Be A Great Title! Also How Many Creatures Are you Thinking Of Per Cartridge Are you Thinking Of Including? Or Are Going One Creature Per Cart Style? The ones I really like are Dragon, Turtle, Ghost, Rabbit, Frog, and Mole. There are over 50 sprites per pet so I'll be adding them really slowly, and I have to really like one to create it. When the original pet is completely done I'll start on one of these. Can you pick a favorite for me to try first? There will be one per cart, and I haven't settled on a title yet. It's hereLet me know if you want to reserve some space. I do and I really appreciate it. I'm not sure how much space yet though, I really just started this project. The memcard looks perfect, and the interface for it makes it perfect for loading multiple pets. I believe Chris Cracknell started a 2600 Virtual pet program back in the early homebrew days( 1995-2000 ), but I don't think he went very far with it. I have the ROM around here somewhere... Or you can find it in the Stella list archives. Yes, this would be a fun idea! I looked it up, I didn't know it had been done before. The demo is really cute, but not much like what I've done so far. I have to say it's a lot more colorful, mine looks more like a keychain version. You are right that lack of a good way to save the game in 97 (on real hardware) would have made this project more of a challenge. Glad you like the idea, it's been fun to create so far. In an emulator, you can save the state. In real hardware, yes, the memcard is the best way, and bB support is planned. When completed, it will save or restore the entire state of the game in progress in a single command. The memcard support was a little mired by (some ridiculous) protocol suggestions, but I think we came to a consensus (or an impasse, I can't remember which.) Now it's mostly a matter of me getting around to actually writing the code. I have a memcard, but I've not written the code yet, for no good reason but laziness and a lack of requests (until now.) I really hope you do go ahead with the memcard support, it's exactly what I need! I read the thread with some people telling you it should be far down your list, but it seems extremely useful to me. When support is done, I'll definately be one of the first to use it, and not just with this project. Edited May 17, 2006 by MausBoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 (edited) Thanks! My Favorite (And Easiest Most likely) Would either Be The dog (CTCW) Or The Turtle (MB) Also If you Need Any More Ideas Or anything Just Ask. Edited May 17, 2006 by Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brpocock Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 Which classic VCS "creatures" would you like to see featured as VCS-Pets? The Three Ducks!! (from Adventure, of course.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candiru Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 OK, I have ZERO knowledge of what it takes to program for the 2600, so there's a good chance this suggestion is utterly useless. And with that reassuring disclaimer..... Would it be possible to do a code-based save like Secret Quest? Once you decide to shut down the VCS, maybe hit the B/W button on the system and it shows a code that reflects the progress you've made. For a battle mode, each player could enter in the code for their character and then begin the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brpocock Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 (edited) Would it be possible to do a code-based save like Secret Quest? Once you decide to shut down the VCS, maybe hit the B/W button on the system and it shows a code that reflects the progress you've made. It's a pain, but it's doable. The code gets progressively longer the more data you need to save, and it takes a bit of overhead if you don't already have text-handling routines and such in your program. I'm using the RESET switch for it on CiE... tap RESET, then the code appears (and I'll save to a MemCard if present) and you would need to choose "QUIT" from a menu... on the theory that you wouldn't ever actually want to be dumped back to the title screen without saving. Just because it's kinda scary to pull the RESET switch, though, in CiE it's also an option from the in-game menus (If using a 32-character alphabet, say, A-Z and 0-5, you get 5 bits per character, so to save all of RAM (128 bytes x 8 = 1024 bits) would take 205 characters edit: 205, but the 205th has a few bits free, bad math) Edited May 17, 2006 by brpocock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 Yeah, but you won't ever want/need to save all of RAM. And most likely you are going to have to add some kind of text handling if you are going to allow game saves anyway. But codes do suck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Helmet Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 I think an unlockable character could be NE1's avatar Maybe not I love the idea of using classic VCS characters. Don't forget E.T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MausBoy Posted May 17, 2006 Author Share Posted May 17, 2006 I would much rather not use a code system, but I can see how it would be useful. As far as a memcard, how would that work for a game in progress to load up 4 people's pets? Say one person had the tournament cart, and four people had a pet on their memcard. Can I program it so that each player can insert their memcard one at a time to load their pet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MausBoy Posted May 17, 2006 Author Share Posted May 17, 2006 (edited) My programming and graphics skills are pretty limited, this game isn't going to look as good as the demo already posted. I've finished the egg, baby, toddler, youth, and adult sprites for the first vp, so I'll post a half-working demo very soon. I'm having trouble deciding what attributes the vp's should have. I have health, mood, and strength. What would be a good fourth one? There are seperate hunger and stamina meters, if hunger goes too low the vp dies, if stamina goes too low it falls asleep. Also what actions for the menu would be best? So far there are 'Feed' 'Put To Bed' 'Play' - for baby & toddler 'Train' - for youth & adult edit - I added 'Cure', 'Discipline', and got rid of the stamina meter. Now if stamina is low the vp whines and won't do much, you can tell pretty easily without a meter. edit - I removed the mood meter, now mood is shown by the color of the vp's "jewel" - what they all use for their "special ability" attack, and the playfield. Now the only meters onscreen are health and strength. Edited May 18, 2006 by MausBoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brpocock Posted May 17, 2006 Share Posted May 17, 2006 As far as a memcard, how would that work for a game in progress to load up 4 people's pets? Say one person had the tournament cart, and four people had a pet on their memcard. Can I program it so that each player can insert their memcard one at a time to load their pet? Yes. Apparently when it's actively doing reads/writes the AVox/MemCard can be dis/re-connected at whim. (It could probably survive a "read" disconnect but your cart might flake?) And/or, you could have multiple "file slots" on one MemCard, as well. Named critters, pull up a menu like, LOAD CRITTER? COOKIE ZELDA RHINDLE NE146 ---- (unused slot) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MausBoy Posted May 17, 2006 Author Share Posted May 17, 2006 (edited) I'm not putting an alphabet character set into the game, so if it allows multiple vp saves they will be numbered not named. Thanks for the info, that's very helpful. I'll still have to learn how to read and write variables from the memcard, batari has only mentioned saving game states. Edited May 17, 2006 by MausBoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gateway Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 My programming and graphics skills are pretty limited, this game isn't going to look as good as the demo already posted. I've finished the egg, baby, toddler, youth, and adult sprites for the first vp, so I'll post a half-working demo very soon.I'm having trouble deciding what attributes the vp's should have. I have health, mood, and strength. What would be a good fourth one? There are seperate hunger and stamina meters, if hunger goes too low the vp dies, if stamina goes too low it falls asleep. Also what actions for the menu would be best? So far there are 'Feed' 'Put To Bed' 'Play' - for baby & toddler 'Train' - for youth & adult edit - I added 'Cure', 'Discipline', and got rid of the stamina meter. How 'bout a "Special Ability" meter? Each vp would have a unique ability or something like that for battling and they would have to conserve a bit of energy in order to use it. Just noticed your edit. Is this what "Discipline" would be? Just brainstorming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 I would much rather not use a code system, but I can see how it would be useful. As far as a memcard, how would that work for a game in progress to load up 4 people's pets? Say one person had the tournament cart, and four people had a pet on their memcard. Can I program it so that each player can insert their memcard one at a time to load their pet? Almost 8 years ago to the day (OMG i'm old), I wrote on the [stella] list about fractional bit representation of coded values. You should review this if you are interested in encoding game states. For example, instead of requiring 5 bits per letter (if you're encoding letters), you really only need log2(26) which is roughly 4.7 bits. It sounds screwy, but if you read that post carefully you will see it is possible. So you really can improve the compression quite a bit more than you might expect. And I'm sure many readers would not have been aware of this technique -- it's worth reviewing, as it's a real left-field solution. Me, I'd like to see a stock-standard cart using a smallish code for 'storage'. Good luck! Cheers A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 Thanks for that link, Andrew, that looks very interesting (I'll have to read it through a few more times, though!) and possibly helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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