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Because Battlesphere uses EPROMS, will bit-rot be a problem?


courtesi

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But yet conveniently there is copies "found from the "left overs" and so on once in a while and one or two more carts or CD's get out for auction. Not a bad way to get $500 bucks when you need it I guess.

Hey look another one!

 

"This game and many other rare ScatoLOGIC items will be auctioned off in the coming months to help combat software piracy."

 

:ponder: :lol:

Seller needs funds to buy Hummer mud flaps and micro digital cameras to help combat software piracy. :twisted: :roll:

 

They should just dump the ROM of Battlesphere and release it to the internet for preservation. This would give the emulator authors something interesting to do, or allow people like Songbird to make copies. It's not my intellectual property, but if it were, I would have stopped this insanity by now. There's no need to encourage hoarding and scalping of plastic cartridges like this, for charity or not.

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It seemed like a impressive programming effort, you can tell a lot of effort went into it and is a quality title, but frankly I never got the appeal of it either. Judging by the very little I've seen of people mentioning actually playing it over the years, I don't seem to be alone.

 

I feel sorry for the people paying those prices almost, though they deserve it for doing it. I can't blame ScatLOGIC for selling copies at those prices, could fund things like a new PC pretty quickly at those prices. :)

Edited by Atariboy
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Or you can just move on with your life and not bother buying it. Hey, it's a good game and all, but not $600 good.

Well that kinda goes without saying, doesn't it. I would love to play it in a more reasonable form if the opportunity becomes available.

 

I asked the seller what "helping to combat software piracy" was intended to mean, and this is what I got:

 

There has been a recent rash of threats of dumping and sharing BattleSphere, which potentially harms the contributions to the charities which auctions of the small amount of leftover unsold cartridges generates. These test cartridges were used so they can't legally be sold as new product, so they are being auctioned to pay for all the fees to obtain trademarks and copyrights which were required to insure that it would be illegal worldwide to dump/distribute this game. It is a shame that people would steal from our charity sales, but this is what the world has come to. We would much rather have donated this money to a charity cause instead.

 

Q.E.D. :roll: :roll: :roll:

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I would like to thank everyone who responded to my question. I didn't mean for this to turn into a piracy debate!

 

After spending some serious time thinking about it - I think instead of buying Battlesphere I am going to pick up a copy of Star Raiders and a Atari 800 computer instead. I will take the extra money saved and invest it in my kids college fund.

 

Thanks again!

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Holy Drama Queens Batman! :-o

 

That is at the same time the funniest and saddest thing I've read in a while.

 

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that anyone who's paying $1000+ for a "Super Duper One of a Kind Special Charity Auction Cart" is going to buy it regardless of any possible existence of ROM dumps.

 

And spending money to "obtain trademarks and copyrights which were required to insure that it would be illegal worldwide to dump/distribute this game" isn't going to stop anyone from doing anything anywhere. I'm pretty sure Sony, et al has some pretty good IP lockups, and yet there are illegal copies of their software everywhere. :roll: Stop the BS BS already.

 

It's sad that such nonsense has and obviously continues to surround probably the finest game ever made for the Jag. :(

Edited by remowilliams
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Or you can just move on with your life and not bother buying it. Hey, it's a good game and all, but not $600 good.

Well that kinda goes without saying, doesn't it. I would love to play it in a more reasonable form if the opportunity becomes available.

 

I asked the seller what "helping to combat software piracy" was intended to mean, and this is what I got:

 

There has been a recent rash of threats of dumping and sharing BattleSphere, which potentially harms the contributions to the charities which auctions of the small amount of leftover unsold cartridges generates. These test cartridges were used so they can't legally be sold as new product, so they are being auctioned to pay for all the fees to obtain trademarks and copyrights which were required to insure that it would be illegal worldwide to dump/distribute this game. It is a shame that people would steal from our charity sales, but this is what the world has come to. We would much rather have donated this money to a charity cause instead.

 

Q.E.D. :roll: :roll: :roll:

 

Ok, in the response you got, the seller says the cartridge is used. In the auction, it's listed as new and "factory sealed." So if they "can't legally be sold as new product," why is it described as such.

 

If they really wanted to combat dumping and sharing of the game, then they should produce it and make it available. They're saying there's demand for it, but don't want to meet it, and then say they feel threatened by people wanting the game they don't want to provide. ???

 

And here's a real brain twister - they say the "threats of dumping and sharing" harm contributions to charity that their selling these carts generates. So to fight that, and preserve their charitable donations, they are selling carts and not giving to charity? So the effect is the same.

 

And how realistic is it that this game will ever by dumped and shared? I'm not aware of it happening. I doubt a copyright or trademark will prevent it, if it happens, if it's possible.

 

And shouldn't trademarks and copyrights been obtained when the game was first developed? We're talking several years ago.

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...And how realistic is it that this game will ever by dumped and shared? I'm not aware of it happening. I doubt a copyright or trademark will prevent it, if it happens, if it's possible...

Stop making sense!! :lol:

 

Seriously though, I have little doubt that some of the kool-aid drinkers will be along soon enough to tell us why we're all so wrong! :P

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Seriously though, I have little doubt that some of the kool-aid drinkers will be along soon enough to tell us why we're all so wrong! :P

 

Ahhh! That´s better. You called?

 

The game itself aside, there´s this.

They previously sold these things for charity. That was all part of the Hasbro deal IIRC. Therefore dumping and distributing it is fundamentally a pretty rotten thing to do. If the game's not worth a lot of money to people, that's fine. They're not forcing anyone to pay that price. Those that were previously auctioned off, all generated a certain amount of money (however insignificant in the grand scheme it may be) to various good causes.

 

Anyway. All this talk of pirating the game, I´m sure, is a step in the wrong direction if you really want to see the game in production at all again. Ever.

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Anyway. All this talk of pirating the game, I´m sure, is a step in the wrong direction if you really want to see the game in production at all again. Ever.

be serious : THEY WILL NEVER PRODUCE MORE piracy or not, no interest for them by doing it

 

dumping and sharing BattleSphere

oh ... FACTS ?

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dumping and sharing BattleSphere

oh ... FACTS ?

 

Not necessarily facts, but anyone with just basic knowledge of French can do a quick search on the Yaronet forums and find, if not exactly incriminating posts, then at least a lot of "intent".

 

no not necessarily of course, not this time, thanks to your basic french knowledge you should have found these dumps, don't you ? no ? it was only "intents" then ?... but really "intents" or just words like "I'll dump his f**** game, damned flammer" ?

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dumping and sharing BattleSphere

oh ... FACTS ?

 

Not necessarily facts, but anyone with just basic knowledge of French can do a quick search on the Yaronet forums and find, if not exactly incriminating posts, then at least a lot of "intent".

 

no not necessarily of course, not this time, thanks to your basic french knowledge you should have found these dumps, don't you ? no ? it was only "intents" then ?... but really "intents" or just words like "I'll dump his f**** game, damned flammer" ?

Whatever. It´s probably in the eye of the beholder.

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Not necessarily facts, but anyone with just basic knowledge of French can do a quick search on the Yaronet forums and find, if not exactly incriminating posts, then at least a lot of "intent".

Hum, I saw humour, good and bad, second degree, third and even forty-second degree, but not real dump or even real intent.

 

But maybe my french is not really good, who knows ?

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I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that anyone who's paying $1000+ for a "Super Duper One of a Kind Special Charity Auction Cart" is going to buy it regardless of any possible existence of ROM dumps.

 

Hmm, I wonder how expensive that Mona Lisa painting would be if all reproductions had never been done.

 

Heck, I mean, it goes for x hundred millions right now...

 

Personally I just feel it is a great pity that the size of someones wallet puts limits to their jaguar interest. Collectors items will always be collectors items, and I doubt that making some stuff available will end that. Instead we might see renewed interest, and even get more people interested. I know many people that had an avid interest in the past, that just grew tired of it all.

 

I'm more of an ST guy, and every now and then I turn to my jaguar to see if something new has happened. Nothing ever happens, and projects that might stimulate new interest & development is constantly getting shafted by the avid collectors fearing for the value of their collections. Most talented coders are lousy at hardware, they have problems obtaining & installing something like bjl. Most talented coders with enough time to actually do something, have no money either, because they are still in school or between jobs. Instead development hardware is accumulating with the collectors.

 

For every other console out there, there is atleast one forum with dedicated enthusiasts that discuss & publish their latest efforts with new software. I think I saw one for Jaguar a couple of years back, and it was dead.

 

I have a feeling that the jaguar community in this regard is shooting themselves in the foot. Which is both funny & sad, especially when you look through the threads in this forum, that on regular interval seems to be repeating the very same questions: "What is your favourite game", "What did atari do wrong"...

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Bit rot is real.
But how often is a cart lost to bit rot? I tend to think this is an extremely rare event.

 

Bit rot happens, but if the EPROMs are stored in the proper environment they should last 20+ years or more. Out of the hundreds of 20+ year old prototypes I've dealt with over the years (some stored in good conditions, some not), only one has had gone bad and I'm not even sure that was due to bit rot or electrical damage. So the answer is, yes it happens but it is VERY rare. I imagine the BattleSphere eproms will be good for the next 20 years or so.

 

Tempest

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All the paranoia about "bit rot" is mostly nonsense. Everything is going to die at some point. The acid in the ink and glue will destroy the boxes and manuals and labels of all games. All chips will decay over time as well. They are not sealed well enough to prevent moisture from corroding the etched silicon. All games will die sooner or later.

 

I agree about the life expectancy of BattleSphere or indeed the rest of the Jaguar carts. They´ll probably outlast most of us, or at least the timeframe in which we see this an active "hobby".

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be serious : THEY WILL NEVER PRODUCE MORE piracy or not, no interest for them by doing it

 

Funny you should mention that.

I remember a lot of people saying that very same thing after BattleSphere went out of production. That is, right up until the point where BattleSphere Gold was released.

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If I recall correctly (and I admit perhaps I don't), TBird actually posted a few times that they were done with producing more copies of BS - until BSG magically appeared out of nowhere.

 

I note that TBird has been absent for weeks now. Maybe he's really walked away from the Jaguar, but it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if we were to suddenly see a posting one day advertising a production run for BattleSphere Platinum or Crystal or whatever...

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They previously sold these things for charity. That was all part of the Hasbro deal IIRC.

Fair enough, but how do you get from there to here:
Therefore dumping and distributing it is fundamentally a pretty rotten thing to do.

If something was previously sold for charity, it can never be given away at any future date? I honestly don't understand your reasoning.

If the game's not worth a lot of money to people, that's fine. They're not forcing anyone to pay that price. Those that were previously auctioned off, all generated a certain amount of money (however insignificant in the grand scheme it may be) to various good causes.
The first runs were ostensibly for diabetes research. The second run is to "fight software piracy." If I had enough money/interest to piss away $600 for Battlesphere, I would be much more interested in the former than the latter.
Anyway. All this talk of pirating the game, I´m sure, is a step in the wrong direction if you really want to see the game in production at all again. Ever.

Are you Scott Legrand or are you Doug Engle? :ponder: I can't think of anyone else in the community who would care about such a thing. As of today, the super-limited distribution of Battlesphere is about the same as if it had never been released. Artificially inflating its value by restricting its supply is 4plays/Scatologic's prerogative, but that doesn't mean they can't be criticized for their greed. The price is understandable for a collectible, but for those who would enjoy playing the game, it's a guarantee that they'll be disappointed. Gathering enough cartridges and hardware to play a networked game of Battlesphere would cost more than the PS3, XBOX 360, and Wii combined.
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If I recall correctly (and I admit perhaps I don't), TBird actually posted a few times that they were done with producing more copies of BS - until BSG magically appeared out of nowhere.

 

I note that TBird has been absent for weeks now. Maybe he's really walked away from the Jaguar, but it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if we were to suddenly see a posting one day advertising a production run for BattleSphere Platinum or Crystal or whatever...

 

Developers develop. Remember the recent BattleSphere Trio contained a brand new intro (haven´t seen it in action but from the stills it looked utterly amazing). Things could be happening. Then again maybe not.

Bottom line is, that the mere mention of dumping, pirating or distributing the BattleSphere rom could affect something taking place below radar so to speak.

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If I recall correctly (and I admit perhaps I don't), TBird actually posted a few times that they were done with producing more copies of BS - until BSG magically appeared out of nowhere.

 

I note that TBird has been absent for weeks now. Maybe he's really walked away from the Jaguar, but it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if we were to suddenly see a posting one day advertising a production run for BattleSphere Platinum or Crystal or whatever...

 

 

And how much will the Platinum be? 3? 4? 5 HUNDRED dollars? What about BattleSphere Gamers Edition that costs $30 or $40 bucks for a loose cart with a label and a printed manual? I suppose that would be to much to ask.

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If something was previously sold for charity, it can never be given away at any future date? I honestly don't understand your reasoning.

 

That´s not what I´m saying either. My point is this. Since ScatoLOGIC themselves haven´t earned ANYTHING from a game they worked their asses off for what, eight years, by donating the money to various charities in return for actually opening the system to the public (hence prolonging the Jaguar´s life expectancy tremendously), this is NOT how we repay them.

It´s fair enough to ask them whether or not they like the idea of having the rom distributed freely, but if they say no (and it is their privilege), my advice would be to honor that request. Going against it would be tactless.

 

The first runs were ostensibly for diabetes research. The second run is to "fight software piracy."

 

The game´s been auctioned off for the benefit of various other causes along the way. I seem to at least remember 9-11 auctions and Katrina auctions.

 

Are you Scott Legrand or are you Doug Engle? :

 

Neither. But I do care.

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What about BattleSphere Gamers Edition that costs $30 or $40 bucks for a loose cart with a label and a printed manual? I suppose that would be to much to ask.

Nothing´s impossible.

However, the constant threats of dumping and sharing the rom are probably what convinced ScatoLOGIC to quit making more copies in the first place. Who do you know that would risk thousands of dollars making a batch of something that you couldn't sell because some joker stole it and gave it away for free. My guess is, that you can thank these malicious threats for the current availability AND for the rarity of the game that is driving the price up. That, and not some sinister scheme cooked up by the ScatoLOGIC team.

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