tiktektak Posted June 4, 2007 Share Posted June 4, 2007 Hello to all atariage members.... I looked through quite some posts on this forum but noone seems to have my specific problem. So I decided to ask directly if some jaguar specialist can help a noob jaguar user.... I have an american jaguar(red on button).... Now I bought a peritel(scart) rgb cable because I wanted to get the best picture out of my television when playing jaguar games. The big problem is that when I turn on my jaguar the picture is nice and the sound is ok BUT the picture keeps rollinh from top to bottom of the tv screen in an awesome speed.... Like spinning a wheel... Now I'm asking myself if it could be that the US jaguar hasn't the right pinout to use a peritel cable with.... Could it be that the vertical synchronisation is missing? I do not know that much about tvs and such stuff so don't hit me if I'm talking nonsense.... Another thing I see is that my TV(I'm on the right AV channel by the way, switched there manually before turning the jaguar on) goes into RGB for the first second or so and then when it starts rolling it takes away the rgb indicator(top left of the screen)... Ok enough talking. Does anyone know what the heck is going on? Regards Sebastian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atarimania75 Posted June 4, 2007 Share Posted June 4, 2007 Hello to all atariage members.... I looked through quite some posts on this forum but noone seems to have my specific problem. So I decided to ask directly if some jaguar specialist can help a noob jaguar user.... I have an american jaguar(red on button).... Now I bought a peritel(scart) rgb cable because I wanted to get the best picture out of my television when playing jaguar games. The big problem is that when I turn on my jaguar the picture is nice and the sound is ok BUT the picture keeps rollinh from top to bottom of the tv screen in an awesome speed.... Like spinning a wheel... Now I'm asking myself if it could be that the US jaguar hasn't the right pinout to use a peritel cable with.... Could it be that the vertical synchronisation is missing? I do not know that much about tvs and such stuff so don't hit me if I'm talking nonsense.... Another thing I see is that my TV(I'm on the right AV channel by the way, switched there manually before turning the jaguar on) goes into RGB for the first second or so and then when it starts rolling it takes away the rgb indicator(top left of the screen)... Ok enough talking. Does anyone know what the heck is going on? Regards Sebastian Hi Sebastian, i believe if you have a U.S. console (NTSC Format) and you are trying to play a European (Pal Format) game on it......it will roll because NTSC Consoles do not play Pal games correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atariman Posted June 4, 2007 Share Posted June 4, 2007 (edited) Well, if you're not in the U.S., my guess would be that the Jag is still outputting a 60Hz signal (while your TV is looking for a 50Hz signal). If you are in the U.S. then I'm not sure what the problem might be. I'm no PAL expert (hell, I'm no NTSC expert, either), so perhaps someone else might have more ideas. Good luck! EDIT: Atarimania75 posted while I was posting! I think we're on the same page, though. Edited June 4, 2007 by atariman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted June 4, 2007 Share Posted June 4, 2007 This can be fixed. But the Jaguar has to be opened and I don't have the specifics here, now, but it is just a matter of changing a soldered jumper for the 60Hz position on the motherboard into the 50Hz position, then as long as you have the proper European power adapter and your scart cable, it will work fine after that, or, get a TV/monitor that is capable of handling 50&60Hz refresh rates and it will fix itself (many newer TV's are dual compatible NTSC/PAL). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiktektak Posted June 4, 2007 Author Share Posted June 4, 2007 (edited) Ok thanks for your first suggestions.... Some things I looked up because I looked into the subject a little bit more.... ad NTSC/PAL: I read in a big Jaguar FAQ that the Jaguar can play any region game on any console isn't that right? I thought it detects if the game is ntsc or pal and then makes the right output..... Ad my TV not NTSC compatible: I played many games in 60HZ(many gamecube games for example have a 60Hz mode) and it always worked perfect.... I've got a JAP Neo Geo(with RGB cable) and it works perfect too.... Maybe it has something to do with the cable made for PAL machines? Ad the frequency mod: I also read about the frequency mod which should be easy to perform but I thought it won't be necessary because I anyway want to play all my games in 60Hz and this is what a NTSC jaguar outputs right? Any things I didn't get right or other suggestions? Again thanks to eeryone for the fast replys! Regards Sebastian Edited June 4, 2007 by tiktektak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerosquare Posted June 4, 2007 Share Posted June 4, 2007 I read in a big Jaguar FAQ that the Jaguar can play any region game on any console isn't that right?That's correct. I thought it detects if the game is ntsc or pal and then makes the right output.....In fact, it works the other way around : a (non-modded) American Jaguar will always generate a 60 Hz video signal, and an European one will always generate a 50 Hz signal. All cartridges were required by Atari to support both standards. Maybe it has something to do with the cable made for PAL machines?No, the SCART cable can be used on American Jaguars without problems. Ad the frequency mod:I also read about the frequency mod which should be easy to perform but I thought it won't be necessary because I anyway want to play all my games in 60Hz and this is what a NTSC jaguar outputs right? Right. Any things I didn't get right or other suggestions?Since your TV supports 60 Hz, the most probable thing is that the wire in the cable that carries the composite sync signal is broken. It's pin 20 on the Scart connector, and either pin 5B or 11B on the Jaguar.http://www.hardwarebook.info/SCART http://www.hardwarebook.info/Atari_Jaguar_A/V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiktektak Posted June 4, 2007 Author Share Posted June 4, 2007 Hey again! I just measured the passage(if an electrical signal gets through) of my official jaguar rgb cable with a multimeter and this is what came out: 1A AL Audio Left OK 2A AGND Audio Ground OK 3A GND Ground NO PASSTHROUGH 4A GND(chroma) Ground (Chroma) OK 5A B RGB Blue OK 6A HSYNC Horizontal sync OK 7A G RGB Green OK 8A CHROMA Chroma NO PASSTHROUGH 9A GND ??? Ground ??? NO PASSTHROUGH 10A ? ? NO PASSTHROUGH 11A +10V +10 VDC OK 12A ? ? NO PASSTHROUGH 1B AR Right audio OK 2B AGND Audio GND OK 3B GND Ground OK 4B R RGB Red OK 5B CSYNC Composite (Vertical) Sync NO PASSTHROUGH 6B ? ? NO PASSTHROUGH 7B LGND Luminance Ground OK 8B LUM Luminance NO PASSTHROUGH 9B GND Ground OK 10B CVBSGND Composite Video Ground OK 11B CVBS Composite Video OK 12B ? ? NO PASSTHROUGH Does that tell somebody if that cable is ruined? If I understand it right it is not good that there isn't a signal coming through for the vertical sync am I right? Does it tell somebody anything else? Should I get a new cable? Thanks for all your help so far!!!! Regards Sebastian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Moss Posted June 5, 2007 Share Posted June 5, 2007 Does that tell somebody if that cable is ruined? If I understand it right it is not good that there isn't a signal coming through for the vertical sync am I right? Does it tell somebody anything else? Should I get a new cable? Thanks for all your help so far!!!! Regards Sebastian Some TV's/Monitors will take the Sync of the Green, it sounds like your cable was wired up with that in mind as it definitately sounds like a V sync problem. This does does not necessarily mean you need a new cable as the V sync connection may have been made at the Jaguar end just not wired in at the Scart end, I had the same problem when I purchased my Jag-Scart cable from Telegames IIRC dispite have a 26way ribbon cable when I traced it through it was only wired for RGB and Audio, fortunately when I complained about this they rewired the Scart end for free. If you can make the V sync connection with the existing cable and it still rolls then the speed of the Frame oscillator may need adjusting slightly, there is usually a small range over which it will display a stable image from TV reception and it is generaly set to the centre of this but if it has drifted a little it may have just moved enough to create a problem with the Jag but not normal RF reception, sometimes the pots for adjusting these are clearly labled on the PCB but such an adjustment is best done by a professional and with an insulated adjuster as there is often high voltage involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiktektak Posted June 5, 2007 Author Share Posted June 5, 2007 Hey again! You know what is funny about it? Today I tried the scart cable on the other scart port of my TV(which is not RGB capable) and there I got a very nice picture. Not rgb but without any rolling.... On the other hand I took a closer look at the screen when I plug the scart cable in my scart 1 socket(which is rgb capable)... It goes into rgb mode for a second but then looses "it" which means it switches back to non rgb mode but starts rolling and rolling. Weird isn't it? Seems like the rolling has something to do with the rgb mode...?!? Or is it the vsync? but if it's the vsync why do I get a non rolling picture when I plug the cable in my non rgb scart port 2? Any other help? I allready talked to the shop where I purchased the cable. They said I can send it back BUT they will test it and then decide what to do.... That's not that good because such things always seem to function properly when tested by the seller.... Regards Sebastian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerosquare Posted June 5, 2007 Share Posted June 5, 2007 That makes me think of something. The same SCART pin (20) is used for composite video (in composite mode) and composite synchronization (in RGB mode). On at least some Jaguar RGB cables, this pin is connected to the Jaguar's composite video output. This means that the cable will still work with non-RGB compatible TV sets, which will display the composite signal. But RGB-compatible TV sets will then get composite video on an input where they expect composite synchronization. Most are able to work with this, but maybe yours can't ? It would be interesting to connect SCART pin 20 to the Jag's true composite synchronization output. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiktektak Posted June 6, 2007 Author Share Posted June 6, 2007 Ok so slow again.... Which pin of the jaguar connector should be connected to which pin of the scart? How do I know which cable in the scart connector is which? I could try to solder it myself..... But then I can't send the cable back to the shop for sure... If someone could explain in detail which cable I should solder where I could try it..... Regards Seb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerosquare Posted June 6, 2007 Share Posted June 6, 2007 Actually, it would be best to send the cable back to the shop first, and only solder things yourself (or ask them to do it for you) if it turns out the cable is not defective. Check the links I gave previously to locate the pins. I think pin 20 of the SCART is connected to pin 11B of the Jaguar in your cable (you can check this with a multimeter). Connecting it to pin 5B instead may solve your problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiktektak Posted June 6, 2007 Author Share Posted June 6, 2007 Jup you're right.... 20 of the scart is connected to 11B in my cable.... I'll send it in first for sure because if I want to do some soldering on the jaguar side of the cable I have to open the connector up.... It's no problem on the scart end but on the jaguar end I suppose I would have to cut it open.... We will see.... Thanks to everyone who tried to help me! I will get bakc on this when I know what the shop people say.... Regards Sebastian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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