635 replies to this topic

[NE146]

Pixelboy, on Sat Sep 13, 2008 4:40 PM, said:

Well, the NES versions are pretty close, although I admit I never actually took the time to compare them to the arcade games...

Obviously not j/k

Hey that's awesome Eduardo. You know I'm right there as well lining up for one of these

[doubledown]

With all this excitement about the upcoming Pac-Man Collection being released, I've been inspired. I think I'm going to make a custom Pac-Man themed controller for the ColecoVision to honor this great event. Nothing too over-the-top, just a little flash and flair to commerate what will probably go down as the greatest ColecoVision homebrew title of all times.

Eduardo, Luc, if you guys want to collaberate maybe we can come up with a contest of some sort, like Eduardo and I did a few years back, where the winner gets a copy of the game and the controller. Let me know if you guys are interested.

By the by...mark me down for (2) copies of Pac-Man Collection when available.

I'm also curious how the ColecoVision can read a 128k cartridge. Is each 32k block sectioned off for a different game, or does it use the whole content in some sort of bank-switching method?

[Pixelboy]

doubledown, on Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:31 PM, said:

With all this excitement about the upcoming Pac-Man Collection being released, I've been inspired. I think I'm going to make a custom Pac-Man themed controller for the ColecoVision to honor this great event. Nothing too over-the-top, just a little flash and flair to commerate what will probably go down as the greatest ColecoVision homebrew title of all times.

Eduardo, Luc, if you guys want to collaberate maybe we can come up with a contest of some sort, like Eduardo and I did a few years back, where the winner gets a copy of the game and the controller. Let me know if you guys are interested.

Well, it's an interesting project, but I'd like to know more about what you intend to do exactly before we get into it.

Quote

I'm also curious how the ColecoVision can read a 128k cartridge. Is each 32k block sectioned off for a different game, or does it use the whole content in some sort of bank-switching method?

The MegaCart we use for PMC has one static bank of 16K, and the other 16K is switchable among the other 7 banks on the cart. It's also possible to put a 256K, 384K or even 1024K EPROM on the MegaCart PCB, but the adressing system is always the same, only the number of switchable banks varies for the upper 16K block.

[opcode]

doubledown, on Mon Sep 15, 2008 12:31 PM, said:

With all this excitement about the upcoming Pac-Man Collection being released, I've been inspired. I think I'm going to make a custom Pac-Man themed controller for the ColecoVision to honor this great event. Nothing too over-the-top, just a little flash and flair to commerate what will probably go down as the greatest ColecoVision homebrew title of all times.

Eduardo, Luc, if you guys want to collaberate maybe we can come up with a contest of some sort, like Eduardo and I did a few years back, where the winner gets a copy of the game and the controller. Let me know if you guys are interested.

By the by...mark me down for (2) copies of Pac-Man Collection when available.

I'm also curious how the ColecoVision can read a 128k cartridge. Is each 32k block sectioned off for a different game, or does it use the whole content in some sort of bank-switching method?

About the contest, I would love, but it is up to Luc to decide. I believe it would be more interesting if we create a high-score contest using PMC, then give the high scorer a free controller. I mean, IMHO where would be the fun if we merely draw a winner and give him/her a free game and controller? The winner should deserve that. But I don't know, it is just an idea. As I said, it's up to Luc.

About the MegaCart, yes, it uses bank-switching. Two banks of 16KB. The first one is fixed, while the second is switchable with one of the 64 banks, so you have a max ROM size of 1MB.

Edited by opcode, Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:57 AM.

[Pixelboy]

opcode, on Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:56 PM, said:

About the contest, I would love, but it is up to Luc to decide. I believe it would be more interesting if we create a high-score contest using PMC, then give the high scorer a free controller. I mean, IMHO where would be the fun if we merely draw a winner and give him/her a free game and controller? The winner should deserve that. But I don't know, it is just an idea. As I said, it's up to Luc.

Hmm... Not a bad idea, but how would we regulate the high score submissions? Perhaps the contestants can take a digital picture of their TV screen while their Game Over score is displayed. However, with some Photoshop skills, it may be possible to forge a false top score, so i dunno...

[Spector]

opcode, on Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:56 PM, said:

About the MegaCart, yes, it uses bank-switching. Two banks of 16KB. The first one is fixed, while the second is switchable with one of the 64 banks, so you have a max ROM size of 1MB.

The potential for games using this bankswitching method is huge and almost as exciting as the game itself. Phew it's freezing! I wish I hadn't been so bad when I was on Earth now

[doubledown]

This thread is entirely too far down the list people! Let's get geeked up!

I do have a liegitimate question regarding the MegaCart though. Let's say that there was a game produced for the ADAM on a SuperGame Pack, and let's also say that there was a game with the same name made for the ColecoVision in cartridge form, but it lacked some things due to storage size limitations. Without having to completly reprogram the game from the ground up, could the source-code from the ADAM game be loaded onto the MegaCart for use on the ColecoVision without a rediculous amount of effort? No games come to mind , and I'm not trying to hijack this thread into some other direction I swear, just a legitimate inquiry into the MegaCart's capabilities. (If those parties involved wish to continue this discussion in another thread, let me know and i'll delete this and move over to that one)

[opcode]

doubledown, on Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:07 PM, said:

This thread is entirely too far down the list people! Let's get geeked up!

I do have a liegitimate question regarding the MegaCart though. Let's say that there was a game produced for the ADAM on a SuperGame Pack, and let's also say that there was a game with the same name made for the ColecoVision in cartridge form, but it lacked some things due to storage size limitations. Without having to completly reprogram the game from the ground up, could the source-code from the ADAM game be loaded onto the MegaCart for use on the ColecoVision without a rediculous amount of effort? No games come to mind , and I'm not trying to hijack this thread into some other direction I swear, just a legitimate inquiry into the MegaCart's capabilities. (If those parties involved wish to continue this discussion in another thread, let me know and i'll delete this and move over to that one)

Difficult to say. It could be, but depends entirely on the original game. I suspect many ADAM games had a core that stayed in memory, while new graphics and levels were read from tape. So it could be possible, but I cannot say for sure without checking the original game code.
Actually Luc thought about it once, about porting some of those SuperGames. Not sure if he had any progress on that though.

[doubledown]

I know for example that Donkey Kong Jr. loads the crap out of the tape, and displays the title screen, more loading, then displays the game selection screen, then more loading and the first level starts, more loading, and then about half way through the first level the tape stops, and if memory serves, the tape never loads again untill the game is over and the high score entry screen starts to load. While Donkey Kong loads between every if not damn near every screen. Family Feud is similar in that it's loading all the damn time thoroughout the game.

[retroillucid]

doubledown, on Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:07 PM, said:

This thread is entirely too far down the list people! Let's get geeked up!

I do have a liegitimate question regarding the MegaCart though. Let's say that there was a game produced for the ADAM on a SuperGame Pack, and let's also say that there was a game with the same name made for the ColecoVision in cartridge form, but it lacked some things due to storage size limitations. Without having to completly reprogram the game from the ground up, could the source-code from the ADAM game be loaded onto the MegaCart for use on the ColecoVision without a rediculous amount of effort? No games come to mind , and I'm not trying to hijack this thread into some other direction I swear, just a legitimate inquiry into the MegaCart's capabilities. (If those parties involved wish to continue this discussion in another thread, let me know and i'll delete this and move over to that one)

I think it's possible... Daniel already do it with Cabbage Patch Kids SuperGame....
I have this rom and it play like the Supergame
You should ask him

[Pixelboy]

opcode, on Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:20 PM, said:

doubledown, on Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:07 PM, said:

This thread is entirely too far down the list people! Let's get geeked up!

I do have a legitimate question regarding the MegaCart though. Let's say that there was a game produced for the ADAM on a SuperGame Pack, and let's also say that there was a game with the same name made for the ColecoVision in cartridge form, but it lacked some things due to storage size limitations. Without having to completly reprogram the game from the ground up, could the source-code from the ADAM game be loaded onto the MegaCart for use on the ColecoVision without a rediculous amount of effort? No games come to mind , and I'm not trying to hijack this thread into some other direction I swear, just a legitimate inquiry into the MegaCart's capabilities. (If those parties involved wish to continue this discussion in another thread, let me know and i'll delete this and move over to that one)

Difficult to say. It could be, but depends entirely on the original game. I suspect many ADAM games had a core that stayed in memory, while new graphics and levels were read from tape. So it could be possible, but I cannot say for sure without checking the original game code.
Actually Luc thought about it once, about porting some of those SuperGames. Not sure if he had any progress on that though.

All I have to say on the subject is what I said before, which can be summed up into two points:

1) Whether it's Dragon's Lair, Buck Rogers, Super DK, or whatever, the ADAM loads game levels from the tape entirely into its 64K of RAM, which means that there's no telling where the software ROM begins and where RAM starts, from the game's point of view.

2) The only way to know if an ADAM Super Game can be "transposed" (for lack of a better term) to MegaCart format is to disassemble the game's machine code, and analyse it. Anybody out there feels like disassembling 160K of machine code and data? ... ... ... Didn't think so.

For what it's worth, I like to believe it's possible to put a Super Game onto a MegaCart, but there would probably be a lot of work involved.

[doubledown]

Like I said, I was just curious to see if it would be something fairly easy or a huge pain in the ass. If it ended up being easy ColecoVision users could add a few more games to their library with the MegaCart as a medium without having to have a full blown ADAM setup. But still with the MegaCart able to hold more storage than the standard max of 32k, it allows for the option of more detailed and complex games. For the upcoming Pac-Man Collection, I understand it to have 4 games. Pac-Man & Ms. Pac-Man and their Japanese counterparts, if I'm not mistaken, please correct me if I'm wrong. Out of curiosity how large is each particular game? Or doesn't it break down like that, if some or all games share certain data?

[opcode]

^^^^ PMC uses a common bank for all games (16KB). Then another bank for Pac-Man, three banks for Ms Pac-Man, a bank for the opening and options menu, a bank for the opening tune and finally the last bank for.... oh, I cannot talk about that yet...
Of course not all banks are completely full.
About porting games from the ADAM, there is another problem. The ADAM has a lot more of RAM memory than the CV, which has only 1KB.

[doubledown]

Could extra RAM be added via a simple hardware install, or would a whole bunch of stuff need to be in place, both hardware and software wise, for addressing and the likes?

[Pixelboy]

doubledown, on Fri Sep 19, 2008 5:03 PM, said:

Could extra RAM be added via a simple hardware install, or would a whole bunch of stuff need to be in place, both hardware and software wise, for addressing and the likes?

I don't know enough about the ADAM's architecture to answer that question precisely. But if we take the example of Dragon's Lair (and most other Super Games, really), the ROM code of each game level needs to fit inside 16K in order to be (relatively) easy to put into MegaCart banks. For RAM issues, the 16K Memory Pack could help, but that's not the real problem here.

The real problem is that the CV has only 1K of RAM, so in order to make a Super Game work on the basic ColecoVision console, one would need to reshape the assembly code so that all RAM usage is concentrated into that 1K of RAM (this includes the main stack). Even with an extra 16K of RAM to work with, it doesn't change the fact that the machine code would need to be analyzed down to every instruction and restructured, because the original ADAM software was never meant to run on a vanilla CV. We're talking about a programming puzzle of 160 kilobytes here. Just disassembling and porting a 16K MSX or SG-1000 game can be a daunting task, so imagine 160K... One would have to be extremely dedicated to see that kind of project through to the end.

Personally, I believe it can be done, but only a crazy dude with months of free time and nothing better to do could pull it off.

Edited by Pixelboy, Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:06 AM.

[CARTRIDGE STEALER]

Im gettting one but is there any chance you'd work on a follow up for pac man jr and super pac man?

[Pixelboy]

CARTRIDGE STEALER, on Sat Sep 20, 2008 8:26 AM, said:

Im gettting one but is there any chance you'd work on a follow up for pac man jr and super pac man?

In a word, no. If Eduardo does pursue other ColecoVision projects after PMC is done and released, I can assure you that it will have nothing to do with the Pac-Man family.

[Vic George 2K3]

Best wishes to him, whatever he chooses to pursue next.

[King_Salamon]

Can't believe it's actually done! Congrats and count me in for a copy! This is gonna be a great release!

[JamesD]

I was never a Pac-Man fan but I have to admit that's pretty cool.

[opcode]

JamesD, on Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:57 AM, said:

I was never a Pac-Man fan but I have to admit that's pretty cool.

Thank you!
And I must say that we spent an insane amount of hours working in this game. But I have learned my lesson, I don't dare to try another game collection in my life... Oh, and I hope I don't need to play any of the Pac-Man games again either...

Edited by opcode, Wed Sep 24, 2008 7:55 AM.

[doubledown]

opcode, on Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:52 AM, said:

But I have learned my lesson, I don't dare to try another game collection in my life...

...so we're not going to see a release for a near arcade perfect Donkey Kong Collection?! How disappointing! Well if they have to be seperate cartridges, then they have to be seperate cartridges I guess.

[Pixelboy]

doubledown, on Wed Sep 24, 2008 10:20 AM, said:

opcode, on Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:52 AM, said:

But I have learned my lesson, I don't dare to try another game collection in my life...

...so we're not going to see a release for a near arcade perfect Donkey Kong Collection?! How disappointing! Well if they have to be seperate cartridges, then they have to be seperate cartridges I guess.

Consider yourself blessed if Eduardo finishes Donkey Kong Arcade alone. AFAIK, he has no plans to do Donkey Kong Jr or that dreadful (IMO) Donkey Kong 3.

[Bill_Loguidice]

Pixelboy, on Wed Sep 24, 2008 10:49 AM, said:

Consider yourself blessed if Eduardo finishes Donkey Kong Arcade alone. AFAIK, he has no plans to do Donkey Kong Jr or that dreadful (IMO) Donkey Kong 3.

You're probably right about Donkey Kong 3, but it would be quite the coup for the ColecoVision, as it would be the only other console (outside of Japanese-only computers) to receive a home translation of the game outside of the Famicom/NES.

[doubledown]

Eduardo can do it, he can do anything!

Donkey Kong 3 is possibly one of the worst games ever made and I wouldn't ask anybody to waste their time porting it to any system. Donkey Kong Jr. is on the other had a stellar game and if you're gonna bother with Donkey Kong you might as well do Jr. as well. In all honesty if I had my choice of any one game port for the ColecoVision it would be Sega's Flicky. I never played the game in an arcade as a kid, in fact I never even remember seeing one. I found the game through Mame some years back and I love it. I've got it for the Genesis, and I also know it was released for the SG-1000. And since the Telegames Personal Arcade can play CV and SG-1000 games I would think that it would be able to be ported somewhat easily. I can honestly say that I haven't played the SG-1000 version so as far as I know it sucks compared to the original arcade or Genesis port, but the game is fun as hell.

Edited by doubledown, Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:24 AM.