slampam Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 The 1982 (5200) conversion to the A8: http://www.atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?...VERSION_ID=4832 1982 (5200) SI hacks: http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=81006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+therealbountybob Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 The 1982 (5200) conversion to the A8: http://www.atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?...VERSION_ID=4832 1982 (5200) SI hacks: http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=81006 ------ Marius1976: Since no one replied on that, I say it again: there is a really cool port of the 5200 version to our atari 8bit. I think that's the best one for our atari 8bit. Thanks! Just played this version on my 130XE and yes it's a good improvement, if you put it on the hardest game setting it's worth a go. Shame the top-ship is so slow and has no nice explosion sound, and you can keep fire held down. Will take a look at the other mods on the old thread too But there's still a project for someone, someday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+therealbountybob Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Hmm, maybe this is the most authentic / atmospheric version... it is too easy as the invaders move too slow (I played up to level 6 or so) but it has something about it... (Game #14) http://atarionline.pl/v01/index.phtml?suba...&ct=nowinki To play it you need to load the Advanced Basic Compiler Disk/Image then attach this disk and type EXEC space.cod from the command line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianC Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 there was another arcade invaders game called The End (I think) that was vgood and another older one where you shot waves of alien ships that flew down and I think if you made it to a final screen with coloured bars or shields that you had to destroy (not Galaxians) anyone have a clue what this was (Probaby around in the early 80s in the UK) Astro Fighter? Uniwars? I'm so bad at games these days I never even checked if two of my old tricks worked. The Arcade Space Invaders has a count (number of shots fired) that you can use to always get 300 points on the bonus ship. (You have to hit it right on the count, no 2nd tries). Also if things get really bad invaders on the row just before the last row can't shoot you. Their missiles materialize below you. Nope.. none of those work on any of the classic Space Invaders ports. And that was my point really.. everyone who hung in an arcade and played Space Invaders in it's heyday knew those tricks and they were an integral part of the gameplay. However, no home port even has an hint of them. Hence, my theory that the programmers of those early ports simply didn't know about them. All they ported was the basic gameplay part of move left/right, shoot aliens, and avoid shots , I was pointing out that Bandits is the last word when it comes to Galaxian/Space Invaders rip-offs on the good old 8-bits 'Course, Galaxian and Space Invaders are pretty different.. all you do in Galaxian is move left/right, shoot aliens, and avoid shots! One of the versions of Avenger (SI clone) for the C64 has the Nagoya Attack (aka wall of death), but the one with the fatter graphics might not. The Famicom version has it too. Some post NES ports like the GB (both versions), PSX (not the western designed updated one), Saturn, and SNES versions have the Nagoya Attack. The SG-1000 SI lacks the Nagoya Attack, but the MSX one has it. I know some of the other strategies work in a couple of those versions too. Galaxian has scoring based on shooting the boss Galaxians in formation, so it's not just move left/right, shoot aliens, and avoid shots either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 I'm so bad at games these days I never even checked if two of my old tricks worked.The Arcade Space Invaders has a count (number of shots fired) that you can use to always get 300 points on the bonus ship. (You have to hit it right on the count, no 2nd tries).Also if things get really bad invaders on the row just before the last row can't shoot you. Their missiles materialize below you.ah! old memories!- Steve Sheppard I was just going to post about the counting trick, loved that, guaranteed a set of initials on the high score every time All of Atari's home computer releases had all four screens, including the Apple II and C-64 ports. Personally I think the C-64 port is best. For me the Atari one was tops although I seem to remember the Coleco being nice.. The C64 version for me suffered from pastel colours and the sound was just not crisp enough. One word: Bandits. 'Nuff said. One of the many Apple ports that I so loved...I still give it a good blast these days.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R6502A Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Yea that SI is weird looking for sure but the other ports are great. Aside from the ones you've mentioned I really like Frogger, Popeye, River Raid, Lode Runner, Choplifter, Defender, Qix, Robotron, Jungle Hunt, Pengo, One on One Basketball, Ms Pacman, Moon Patrol. And yes, Donkey Kong is awesome, only home version that I know of that has all 4 screens. IMHO Donkey Kong on the Atari 8 bit plays better than the arcade version (I have a full MAME cabinet so the comparison was immediate). 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Yea that SI is weird looking for sure but the other ports are great. Aside from the ones you've mentioned I really like Frogger, Popeye, River Raid, Lode Runner, Choplifter, Defender, Qix, Robotron, Jungle Hunt, Pengo, One on One Basketball, Ms Pacman, Moon Patrol. And yes, Donkey Kong is awesome, only home version that I know of that has all 4 screens. IMHO Donkey Kong on the Atari 8 bit plays better than the arcade version (I have a full MAME cabinet so the comparison was immediate). I'd totally agree with you there, I remember playing both arcade and Atari in the day and found the 8bit really comfy to play. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oky2000 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 (edited) "Atari Invaders" and "Deluxe Invaders" will both look more familiar to you. "Look" being the key word here. All old ports of Space Invaders failed in that they all missed the tricks that made Space Invaders the game it is.. My theory is the programmers just had no clue about them. Yes probably, ditto with why Donkey Kong for A8 is just a terrible mess. The programmers either hated the game or didn't bother to play it enough to convert either of them properly. Ocean Software's Amstrad and C64 port has all four screens, correct speed and scale of graphics and identical gameplay to the arcade. The only people who prefer DK on A8 are people who don't like the arcade or n00bs who've never played it and think big chunky mirrored graphics are impressive. Atari cocked up EVERY version of DK. Bloody awful mess that should be buried next to VCS ET carts in a land fill if you ask me Edited February 14, 2011 by oky2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE146 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Galaxian has scoring based on shooting the boss Galaxians in formation, so it's not just move left/right, shoot aliens, and avoid shots either. Yes if you shoot the Boss Galaxian in formation, or singly attacking, or attacking with 1 or 2 ships it affects the point total (800 max with 2 escorts). But Galaxian really is much more of a pure action/reflex game even though the premise is the same. Space Invaders on the other hand is a lot more deliberate and strategic in it's gameplay (with some tricks available as well). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Yes probably, ditto with why Donkey Kong for A8 is just a terrible mess. Donkey Kong on the Atari 8-bit a mess? Are you sure you're thinking of the correct version? The Atari 8-bit Donkey Kong is widely regarded as one of the best versions. Tempest 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianC Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Galaxian has scoring based on shooting the boss Galaxians in formation, so it's not just move left/right, shoot aliens, and avoid shots either. Yes if you shoot the Boss Galaxian in formation, or singly attacking, or attacking with 1 or 2 ships it affects the point total (800 max with 2 escorts). But Galaxian really is much more of a pure action/reflex game even though the premise is the same. Space Invaders on the other hand is a lot more deliberate and strategic in it's gameplay (with some tricks available as well). yeah, I love SI for the strategy, though I prefer Galaga over Galaxian (still like the latter, though). I like how Infinity Gene on the iPad/iPhone/360 uses the Nagoya Attack as a gameplay element. I haven't tried the iPad version of the original SI, but it's a good sign that the Nagoya Attack is mentioned in the description of it on iTunes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE146 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 I'll be honest in that I never heard of it being called the "Nagoya attack" until the internet.. I believe it was some interview at Taito with the SI creator and he mentioned it in passing. Then later I saw it called that in Space Invaders Extreme as a bonus score, and now it seems to be the standard name. It was always just a technique done in the arcades and I think later I just heard it called the "wall of death" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Yes probably, ditto with why Donkey Kong for A8 is just a terrible mess. Donkey Kong on the Atari 8-bit a mess? Are you sure you're thinking of the correct version? The Atari 8-bit Donkey Kong is widely regarded as one of the best versions. Tempest I totally agree, I'm neither a noob or an arcade hater and think DK on the Atari was a joy to play and a fantastic conversion. All credit to the programmers for bringing the arcade to us at home. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesD Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 One of my biggest complaints with the arcade ports is that they look and play very different than the arcade versions. I guess it comes from spending a lot of time in the arcade. I don't think I ever found a version of SI on any machine that truly duplicated the arcade. Some versions had pretty close graphics and or sound but none of the secret bonuses survived the port. Arcade SI had a neat bonus called "FIRE". To get the bonus, you had to destroy all the aliens except for one from the bottom two rows. Then when you destroyed the final alien it filled the screen with a wedge of asterisks with the word FIRE in the center. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R6502A Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Yes probably, ditto with why Donkey Kong for A8 is just a terrible mess. Donkey Kong on the Atari 8-bit a mess? Are you sure you're thinking of the correct version? The Atari 8-bit Donkey Kong is widely regarded as one of the best versions. Tempest Playability is key! Even if you slightly deviate from the original, the most important thing for a game is playability. There's no point in replicating the arcade graphics pixel for pixel and then have playing the game be an exercise in destroying your controller through execessive force, because Jumpman doesn't move quickly/smoothly enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Yes probably, ditto with why Donkey Kong for A8 is just a terrible mess. Donkey Kong on the Atari 8-bit a mess? Are you sure you're thinking of the correct version? The Atari 8-bit Donkey Kong is widely regarded as one of the best versions. Tempest Playability is key! Even if you slightly deviate from the original, the most important thing for a game is playability. There's no point in replicating the arcade graphics pixel for pixel and then have playing the game be an exercise in destroying your controller through execessive force, because Jumpman doesn't move quickly/smoothly enough. Personally I always thought that was more playable than the arcade version. To each his own I guess, but you're in the minority on this one. Tempest 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE146 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Personally I always thought that was more playable than the arcade version. To each his own I guess, but you're in the minority on this one. I don't think it's "more" playable than the arcade version (which is obviously very playable or it wouldn't be the classic it is today) but the A8bit version is definitely it's own alternate definition of Donkey Kong and extremely fun and playable on it's own. One thing is for sure is it has a little less nuance in what's going on (case in point the # of fireballs on the conveyor belt stage), but it makes up for it by being a lot more fast & loose, and that's what makes it fun I think. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littleman jack Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I recently picked up a new boxed copy of Deluxe Invaders from Video 61 on cartridge. It's quite good, and has some interesting variations, but I wish they had included a two players on one screen variation as in the 2600 version. That being said, I like both Deluxe Invaders and Atari's original Rob Fulop Space Invaders, but I feel they both do fall a little short of the arcade or 2600 versions. And I love both the 8-bit Donkey Kong and the arcade Donkey Kong. I like the description by NE146--the 8-bit DK is fast and loose. The arcade version is slow and tight. But they're both great fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesD Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'm just going to point out that most people substitute the words "more playable" for "easier". Which I can totally understand since the arcade versions were designed to be coin eaters... but I don't necessarily agree with the choice of words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 They couldn't even be bothered to have no autofire - just goes to show the lax attitude. Personally I don't think we need another dozen SI versions on the A8. Just two: - proper arcade version. Boring mono + green graphics, no autofire, as pixel-perfect and near to the arcade as possible, including not firing when at next to last vertical level. - pixel-perfect copy of the 2600 version including the HMove artifacts (just for the hell of it). Sure, it's nothing like the arcade but it's one of those rare games where the 2600 beats all the others. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteD Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'm currently finishing off an SI clone for the C64 which could no doubt be easily ported to A8, so I might do that... It's done exactly the same way as the arcade, drawn into bitmap, invaders updated one at a time, has all the tricks (bullet counting for mothership 300 points etc) pixel perfect collisions, graphics straight out of the ROMs. I've spent a lot of time researching, going through frames of the game spat out of MAME as pngs (about 3000 of them until I sussed you could single frame advance and take screenshots lol) so all the speeds/timings/movement of everything is correct. I found things that I'd never really noticed before like when you hit an alien it actually pauses the whole wave movement routine for 16 frames. The main problem is afaik all the arcade machines are 60fps so on PAL the updating one per frame method seems a tad slow, I could always update 2 every 5th frame or something but I think it's ok as it is. I've added "decal" graphics (done by Ste of course) to fill in the spare bits of the screen (with the arcade only being 224 wide) and the score/lives are in the border to handle the screen being 260 tall. The "decal" also continues into the border to stop it looking a bit naff.. Hopefully be done by the end of the week as most of the remaining code is 1/2 done or just involves re-using existing code. Most of the C64 version suck so I'm hoping this one will go down quite well.. Pete 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesD Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 @PeteD, that certainly looks nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Looks pretty cool... another important aspect is the mother ship - the kill sound on that is one of the best in any arcade game, although I believe all the SI sounds were discreet logic. How about just run the game assuming 60 FPS regardless - the movement is such that you could probably get away with it since not much changes each frame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteD Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Sound is a big issue for me, I'm trying to find someone who can reproduce them as closely as possible. It's the firing noise for me, that's embedded in my brain Theres diagrams of the sound stuff over here Pete 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mimo Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'm currently finishing off an SI clone for the C64 which could no doubt be easily ported to A8, so I might do that... It's done exactly the same way as the arcade, drawn into bitmap, invaders updated one at a time, has all the tricks (bullet counting for mothership 300 points etc) pixel perfect collisions, graphics straight out of the ROMs. I've spent a lot of time researching, going through frames of the game spat out of MAME as pngs (about 3000 of them until I sussed you could single frame advance and take screenshots lol) so all the speeds/timings/movement of everything is correct. I found things that I'd never really noticed before like when you hit an alien it actually pauses the whole wave movement routine for 16 frames. The main problem is afaik all the arcade machines are 60fps so on PAL the updating one per frame method seems a tad slow, I could always update 2 every 5th frame or something but I think it's ok as it is. I've added "decal" graphics (done by Ste of course) to fill in the spare bits of the screen (with the arcade only being 224 wide) and the score/lives are in the border to handle the screen being 260 tall. The "decal" also continues into the border to stop it looking a bit naff.. Hopefully be done by the end of the week as most of the remaining code is 1/2 done or just involves re-using existing code. Most of the C64 version suck so I'm hoping this one will go down quite well.. Pete That looks awesome, please please please port to the A8, please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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