N64 Joystick

[Metal Ghost]

Well, I don't know if it is or not....a very subjective topic indeed! However I came to the conclusion last night while playing Blast Corps that the N64 controller is certainly my least favorite. The primary reason is due to the analog stick itself. I'm so glad that Nintendo revived the idea of analog control and having it at your thumb is awesome. But, did they have to pick the most uncomfortable stick known to man? It's hard plastic with raised rings. After playing with it for 10 minutes or more of hard play your thumb starts to hurt. And it's very difficult to use the d-pad and the analog stick, because they designed them to be almost two seperate sticks (given that there's a middle handle to use while utilizing the analog stick but you hold it from both sides when using the d-pad).

 

It brought a lot of innovation to controllers, but I'm glad we've moved on!

 

What do you all think?

[StoneAgeGamer]

I agree. The analog stick is the weak point of the controller not only in comfort but in durability. Its almost like they thought when they originally designed the controller that the D-pad would be the main form of control for most games, and only a few games would use the analog stick.

 

I guess its somewhat understandable since that generation was the transition from 2D gaming, but you would have thought they would have eventually wised-up and changed the controller's design like Sega and Sony eventually did. Although I don't know if Sega actually packed the 3D controller in with the Saturn at any point, I'm sure someone can educate me on that.

 

What makes it worse is that most 3rd party controllers that are still being made for the N64 have more comfortable sticks, but their analog feedback is way too sensitive, which makes playing some games almost impossible. Especially anything that requires aiming.

[TwinChargers]

Having not ever owned a 5200, Colecovision or Intellivision, I can say that it is the worst controller that I've ever owned. Next would have to be the Gamecube (Didn't care much for the button layout at all, but buildwise it was decent). Nintendo really dropped the ball on joypads for awhile.

[+save2600]

I actually quite liked the controller. To my hands, it was comfortable for both D-pad and analogue control. Especially worked great for Robototron

 

'Z' button was well placed and gratifying as a missile launcher or whatever too.

Edited January 22, 2010 by save2600

[+atari2600land]

I think the Inty joystick is much worse. I mean, what was Mattel thinking?

[+save2600]

I think the Inty joystick is much worse. I mean, what was Mattel thinking?

If you grew up with it, the INTV controller wasn't *that* bad. It seemed to work well enough for the games anyway. Especially Baseball. The disc down toward the bottom was smart, unlike the stubby Colecovision joy nub toward the top. Same reason the 7800 sticks suck. Now whoever thought of putting them toward the top could NOT have been a gamer! lol

 

Also, the Colecovision with the way the keypad is designed (divided up into sections) never allowed for smooth/quick play, unlike the INTV either. Not saying it's the worst controller ever as I think the 7800 may have that distinction. lol (European 7800 pads are horrendous too)

[Ransom]

The only stock controllers I have a hard enough time with to wish for something else are the ones for the 7800. That includes both the "Europads" and the sticks. That's not to say that there aren't certain games that are not a good fit for a given controller, but most of the time the other stock controllers don't give me problems.

 

That said, most controllers are not what I consider to be the height of good design. The most comfortable controllers for long-term play that I've ever used are the ones for the PS2, honestly.

[Metal Ghost]

Stone Age, I think you hit the nail on the head. I agree that Nintendo likely expected the D-Pad to be the primarily used means of control. A bit surprising given that Mario 64 was a launch title, so you'd think that they new the scene was going to be changing. But again as you said, it was a transition period so they may not have anticipated the speed of change. In any case, you can also see where they expected it to be an 'either/or' situation between digital and analog, since it's impossible to switch quickly between the two on an N64 pad. Many games that doesn't matter, but some games I do like to switch depending on the in-game situation.

 

However, along with Sony, Microsoft too changed their controller when community feedback expressed concerns with the original (though I wish MS would now improve their 360 D-Pad in much the same way that they came out with the Controller S!!). I'm really surprised that Nintendo didn't do the same, even if it was in the form of a 1st party non-pack in controller. Maybe at the time there weren't many concerns with the controller....not as much out their to compare it to??

 

I just can't get over how absolutely uncomfortable the physical analog nub is to use for extended periods. Beyond the layout that prevents use of both the D-Pad and analog, it really comes down to the fact that the hard plastic nub feels bad.

 

It's a shame given how many extremely good N64 games I haven't played yet (many of which I actually own and just need to get too!). Since my 360 got the ol' E74 error I thought this would provide the perfect time to catch up. I've never looked for 3rd party N64 controllers, but if there are better ones out there, perhaps I need to.

 

All that being said, I liken the N64 controller to the 5200 controller in certain ways. Both were extremely innovative for their time, though had some (in my opinion) fundamental flaws that really hold back their greatness. I've already expressed my feelings on the N64 flaws, with the obvious 5200 ones being reliability and non-centering stick. But props has to be given for them going out into new territory.

 

I compare that with the Colecovision controller, which I just think is plan bad and not really all that innovative (the keypad had already been done, and I don't really see anything else new on it....maybe the coiled cord?? )

[Metal Ghost]

I think that, with the large caveat of the D-Pad, Xbox 360 contollers are by far my favorite controllers, stock or otherwise. Their weighted well, sized appropriately, and all buttons/sticks have a quality feel to them (please see caveat above!).

 

I never liked the PS dual shocks....this is quite subjective, but I think the sticks feel too loose and I don't like not having the analogs offset. A lot of that is a matter of preference however.

 

I don't mind the 7800 sticks, though the stick themselves always felt very loose. Maybe that's because the only sticks I've ever held are the ones that came with my new 7800 way back when and they've been beaten to death. In fact I sold the system itself and all the games a couple of years ago, so I simply kept one stick for sentimental reasons. But if I actually had to use it again I'd probably really dislike it. I've never used the Euro joypads, but I can see where they might not be good to use. Nothing like trying to hold an oversized pad in your hands!

[mbd30]

Well, I don't know if it is or not....a very subjective topic indeed! However I came to the conclusion last night while playing Blast Corps that the N64 controller is certainly my least favorite. The primary reason is due to the analog stick itself. I'm so glad that Nintendo revived the idea of analog control and having it at your thumb is awesome. But, did they have to pick the most uncomfortable stick known to man? It's hard plastic with raised rings. After playing with it for 10 minutes or more of hard play your thumb starts to hurt. And it's very difficult to use the d-pad and the analog stick, because they designed them to be almost two seperate sticks (given that there's a middle handle to use while utilizing the analog stick but you hold it from both sides when using the d-pad).

 

It brought a lot of innovation to controllers, but I'm glad we've moved on!

 

What do you all think?

 

It's especially bad if you don't hold it properly for analog. Some players might grip it at the sides like a regular gamepad and reach their thumb over to the stick, rather than grip it in the center like they're supposed to.

[DaytonaUSA]

I thought the N64 controller was breath taking at the time. In fact, it wasn't until later in the console's life that I started realizing that the joysticks started to get chalky. I called up Nintendo on my 3 year old system, and no questions asked, sent me new joysticks for each of my controllers with hardware and instructions for free.

 

Looking back, the design choice to have the dpad and joystick on two separate sticks was probably silly to do. It also cut down on buttons as many games could have used the dpad for buttons like Rogue Squadron 2 did with their wingman commands.

 

And yes, the Z button is still my favorite button out of any controller. The middle stick feels amazing ergonomically, and the Z button is still extremely satisfying for shooters.

 

For the person who said the Gamecube controller was badly designed, BOO to you, sir. Seriously, the Gamecube controller is one of the most comfortable, and considerate controller ever made. By considerate I mean they looked at all the issues of controllers and improved them. The triggers are still more comfortable and easy to use than Sony or Microsoft's, the joystick is better than the later two as well, and the button layout just made sense. The A button is primarily what you'll press, so it SHOULD be accentuated.

 

The only thing bad about it was the dpad becuase of it's size. But honestly, it's more responsive than the 360's and still works for fighting games if you give it a chance. Then again, for some reason games like Soul Calibur feel better on the Gamecube with the joystick and not the Dpad, unlike the other two console versions.

[DaytonaUSA]

PS:

 

The worst joysticks of all time would actually be the Intec Gamecube controller. The left joystick was alright I guess, but the C-stick was just a dpad with a joystick over it. There was no middle, it was either up, down, left, right or nothing.

 

This made looking around your cockpit in Rogue Squadron II impossible and ticked me off quite a bit.

[doubleminor]

I don't mind the N64 controller, but the worst is the huge controller on the original Xbox. That thing was atrocious and some.

[figgler]

I always liked the form factor of the N64 controller. When I first got one I felt like I was playing with something from the future. Compared to the SNES pad that came before it, it's like something right out of Star Trek.

As for the D pad, to be honest I can't remember any games that use it or that it would be really good for. N64 had like no 2D games basically. I also totally love the expandability of the controller. Rumble Pak, mem card, etc is a really cool feature and makes it more like a toy in a way, which appeals to me.

But yeah, the stick. Though I find it comfortable, it's really prone to going loose and basically useless as you all know. 4 out of 5 controllers I spot in the wild are too far gone to bring home. the good ones I stock pile, not only because the colouring makes them collectible, but because I am always afraid my stick is going to go on the controller I am using

[+LS650]

I've always thought the N64 controller was pretty decent in design. As for ergonomics, I find it fine, though the analog stick and the buttons were a little too close together for my taste. The N64 controller itself is confortable to hold, and the buttons have nice action and feel. The only changes I would make would be to exchange the locations of the analog and the D-pad, and to make the analog stick out of a tougher material that doesn't slowly wear away into dust.

 

There are much worse controllers out there to complain about.

[Chris Leach]

"What can be said about the N64 controller?"

Nintendo couldn't get the cool Sont Playstation controller, which seemed to last forever. They came up with innovation. Well, the D pad sucked and the c-stick was terrible....

I would play with an INTV controller before I tried the N64 controller anyday.!

[tz101]

This Hori controller for N64 solves the problem of having to stretch to use both the analog stick and the d-pad in a comfortable manner...

[tz101]

I don't mind the N64 controller, but the worst is the huge controller on the original Xbox. That thing was atrocious and some.

 

The Xbox duke controller is awesome. Don't dis it.

[StoneAgeGamer]

This Hori controller for N64 solves the problem of having to stretch to use both the analog stick and the d-pad in a comfortable manner...

 

Yes, but where do you find one?

[Eltigro]

I never thought the N64 controller was uncomfortable. I never got blisters or anything on my thumb while playing. I went through about half of Mario 64 with a broken right hand and still thought it was okay. (Had pins sticking out of my hand, but kept playing... ) But I do agree that the placement of the d-pad makes it pretty awkward to use. Having to take my hand completely off the controller to change positions to use the d-pad or left shoulder button and then go back to the middle handle is kinda annoying.

 

I don't necessarily agree with the idea that they though most games would not use the analog stick though. Maybe very early in the development, when they were still thinking about the SNES, but thinking back, I can't think of a game that used the d-pad instead of the joystick. I mean, there might have been some, I just don't remember them. A lot of games could have been played with either one, I suppose, like the fighting games. Many people prefer to use a d-pad, but I've found that a joystick is often easier, especially if there are a lot of circle moves. It just doesn't feel like something that was added last second to me.

 

The biggest problem I have with N64 controllers is that, now, it can sometimes be difficult to find one that still has a "tight" feel to the joystick. Many are kinda loose and can make control difficult.

 

Also, tz101 posted a pic of a 3rd party controller for the 64 that had a different layout. I remember a different controller that had yet another layout, with the left handgrip being kinda big and the right being smaller, asymmetric if you will. Don't remember who made it but I'll look for a pic and post the name of it if I find it.

 

[Edit] Found it, the Makopad or super pad or something... here's a pic of one.

 

Edited January 23, 2010 by Eltigro

[+LS650]

I had one of those Mako controllers... I prefer the OEM controller.

[Mirage]

Hmmm... I've always quite liked the N64 controller. Different strokes I suppose.

[DaytonaUSA]

I never thought the N64 controller was uncomfortable. I never got blisters or anything on my thumb while playing. I went through about half of Mario 64 with a broken right hand and still thought it was okay. (Had pins sticking out of my hand, but kept playing... ) But I do agree that the placement of the d-pad makes it pretty awkward to use. Having to take my hand completely off the controller to change positions to use the d-pad or left shoulder button and then go back to the middle handle is kinda annoying.

 

I don't necessarily agree with the idea that they though most games would not use the analog stick though. Maybe very early in the development, when they were still thinking about the SNES, but thinking back, I can't think of a game that used the d-pad instead of the joystick. I mean, there might have been some, I just don't remember them. A lot of games could have been played with either one, I suppose, like the fighting games. Many people prefer to use a d-pad, but I've found that a joystick is often easier, especially if there are a lot of circle moves. It just doesn't feel like something that was added last second to me.

 

The biggest problem I have with N64 controllers is that, now, it can sometimes be difficult to find one that still has a "tight" feel to the joystick. Many are kinda loose and can make control difficult.

 

Also, tz101 posted a pic of a 3rd party controller for the 64 that had a different layout. I remember a different controller that had yet another layout, with the left handgrip being kinda big and the right being smaller, asymmetric if you will. Don't remember who made it but I'll look for a pic and post the name of it if I find it.

 

[Edit] Found it, the Makopad or super pad or something... here's a pic of one.

 

 

 

I found that I had to move my thumb way too much on that joystick. I didn't like it much at all. Besides the Hori controller (God, I wish I didn't sell mine...) Nintendo's is the way to go .

[BDW]

I personally love the N64 controller, I've never had any joystick problems or anything of the sort. I thought that the 3 handles were awesome, it looked so futuristic.

[Kripto]

The 7800 joystick is by far the worst controller I've ever used.

 

I never had a complaint about the N64 stick but have encountered many that have been destroyed, seemingly from being too strongly forced around.