44 replies to this topic

[RevEng]

"... Why don't we charge for [PSN]?

"It's been our philosophy not to charge for it from launch up until now, but Kaz [Kazuo Hirai, Chairman and CEO, SCEA] recently went on the record as saying that's something we're looking at. I can confirm that as well. That's something that we're actively thinking about. What's the best way to approach that if we were to do that? You know, no announcements at this point in time, but it's something we're thinking about."

--Peter Dille, Senior VP of Marketing and the PSN, SCEA.

I have to think that a lot of people that were choosing between a PS3 and Xbox360 factored in the fact that PSN was free and XboxLive wasn't. If the go down this road they're going to piss off more than a few customers.

[Atariboy]

While it's not mentioned because it would decrease the number of hits they'd get as people spread this IGN article around, Sony has also gone on record at the same time Sony made that statement (The quote from Hirai that IGN added into this interview) that the current PSN service will remain free.

The aspects of PSN that might require a fee are in addition to what PSN already does, which will remain free (Matchmaking, Home, accessing things like the internet, PSN store, etc.).

Edited by Atariboy, Thu Feb 4, 2010 6:42 PM.

[moycon]

Atariboy, on Thu Feb 4, 2010 6:39 PM, said:

The aspects of PSN that might require a fee are in addition to what PSN already does, which will remain free (Matchmaking, Home, accessing things like the internet, PSN store, etc.).

What exactly does this mean? What aspects are coming that would require a fee?

[Atariboy]

All we've had is a vague statement from Sony (Exact quote below) a couple of months ago. So I know no more about it than you do and your guess is as good as mine as to what premium content and services you'd get for your subscription.

"Especially in the online area, we are studying the possibility of introducing a subscription model, offering premium content and services, in addition to the current free services."

What's clear is the current capabilities of PSN will remain free (Online multiplayer for instance).

Edited by Atariboy, Thu Feb 4, 2010 10:20 PM.

[moycon]

Atariboy, on Thu Feb 4, 2010 10:16 PM, said:

What's clear is the current capabilities of PSN will remain free (Online multiplayer for instance).

My guess is, that is the one thing that won't remain free. Sony is probably tired of floating the very expensive bill of running an online network for gamers.
Expect things like Home and the Sony Store to remain free though. That's my prediction.

[Mendon]

I seriously doubt that Sony is going to charge for online multi-player. But stranger things have happened.

From all the stories and speculations .. by IGN, Joystiq, Kotaku, etc.. that I've read so far, a PSN subscription is going to provide you with such things as early access to demo's (sort of like XBL), exclusive Beta invites, free DLC's... such as themes, wallpapers, avatar merchandise.... that non-subscribers will have to pay for, exclusive HOME areas, upgraded XMB features such as in-game music, and other assorted perks.

I haven't read any column on any news site that speculates that Sony will charge for online multi-player. In fact, most writers speculate that if Sony tried to charge for online multiplayer that there would be an uprising of Biblical proportions by PS3 owners.

Time will tell.


Mendon

[cimerians]

I have a feeling they need to change to a subscription model probably because of Final Fantasy 14.

(FF14 is a massive online RPG like World of Warcraft)

Its slated for PS3 and PC release only and then I trust later on for the 360 but I havent heard news about a 360 version ever happening, I'm sure it will though.

So, it seems logical they need to charge for that but then again, FF14 could be paid seperately but WHY would they charge for online play and ALSO charge for FF14?

Doesnt seem fair to me. So I think FF14 is the reason for the changes that are coming.

Sony also has other online RPG's like Everquest and Free Realms (if I recall)

[Gabriel]

I'm dense, because I just don't understand the concept of charging for access to demos, or the willingness of people to pay for such a privledge. It's like buying a shirt with a company logo on it. You're paying for someone else's advertising.

Of course, with the half assed way the Playstation Store does demos, if they started charging for early access to demos, it would mean members would get access to demos about a year after the game was launched and non-members would never see demos ever again.

As I don't use the PS3 to play multiplayer, I really don't care if they start charging for that.

[doubleminor]

Online gaming should be free. If you want to subscribe to premium content, that's fine; but the gaming part should stay free of charge.

This is why I own a PS3 and not an Xbox.

[moycon]

doubleminor, on Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:45 AM, said:

Online gaming should be free.

Tell that to the guy who floats the HUGE bill to keep a giant gaming network running.

[Chris Leach]

Well, XBOX does it so should we philosophy never worked for nobody!

[SeanXTC]

Free online gaming was the reason I choose PS3 over Xbox. I'm sure there will be an uprising, *if* they do start charging... which to be honest I can't.

[Lord Helmet]

doubleminor, on Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:45 AM, said:

Online gaming should be free.

Why should it be free?

[Crazy Climber]

Lord Helmet, on Thu Jun 3, 2010 10:38 AM, said:

doubleminor, on Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:45 AM, said:

Online gaming should be free.

Why should it be free?

It should be included in the price of the games you purchase. If $60 a game is not enough to foot the server bill, raise the games to $65, etc..

[Lord Helmet]

Crazy Climber, on Sat Jun 5, 2010 9:05 AM, said:

Lord Helmet, on Thu Jun 3, 2010 10:38 AM, said:

doubleminor, on Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:45 AM, said:

Online gaming should be free.

Why should it be free?

It should be included in the price of the games you purchase. If $60 a game is not enough to foot the server bill, raise the games to $65, etc..

Some people buy used games...who pays for them to play online?

[Reaperman]

it's really just a matter of looking at it as a business expense (as has generally been the case and worked) rather than a fee to be passed directly on to the customer. PS3 games generally do cost more than other video games, afterall. Gamers pay either way, however with recent events including the $15 'online entitlement' for modnation psp, there is the distinct possibility exists of online fees regularly being passed on to customers, that used to be part of our expensive initial game purchases.

Adding a new fee where one previously didn't need to be is bound to make plenty of folks unhappy. Really its the feeling of cheapness coming from companies this gen is making me unhappy. It seems everybody's trying to gouge their customers in new and creative ways when there was more than enough profit to keep everything running up to that point.

One thing I do wonder about--A good number of ps3 online games are hosted from user's ps3's using PSN machines for matchmaking. How long will it be before somebody tries to charge us for the ability to let our own systems do the heavy lifting? It's not a big leap to think so. Or will there actually be a 'quality leap' in ps3 online gaming and we'll have fewer of this type of game? I don't know about anybody else, but I'm of the opinion that 'giving something back to the customer for their money' just isn't going to happen these days. If I didn't feel that way, this whole experience would slide down better. As is, I've purchased only one PS3 game this year, and I'm only planning on buying one more in fall. The lack of 'value' I'm feeling is reflecting in my spending habits. Last year I easily spent ten times more on ps3 titles.

Edited by Reaperman, Tue Jun 8, 2010 7:33 AM.

[HammR25]

Crazy Climber, on Sat Jun 5, 2010 9:05 AM, said:

It should be included in the price of the games you purchase. If $60 a game is not enough to foot the server bill, raise the games to $65, etc..

I don't play online. I'd rather not pay for other people to play online.

[Atariboy]

Lord Helmet, on Mon Jun 7, 2010 4:30 PM, said:

Crazy Climber, on Sat Jun 5, 2010 9:05 AM, said:

Lord Helmet, on Thu Jun 3, 2010 10:38 AM, said:

doubleminor, on Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:45 AM, said:

Online gaming should be free.

Why should it be free?

It should be included in the price of the games you purchase. If $60 a game is not enough to foot the server bill, raise the games to $65, etc..

Some people buy used games...who pays for them to play online?

The original owner did when he purchased the game.

The game wasn't created used. If the server fee was subsidized by the initial purchase, there's no need for the secondary owner to also subsidize the service. Reselling a game used doesn't increase the number of copies of a game out there or increase the strain on the company's servers.

Edited by Atariboy, Wed Jun 9, 2010 11:09 PM.

[Mord]

Atariboy, on Wed Jun 9, 2010 10:51 PM, said:

The original owner did when he purchased the game.

The game wasn't created used. If the server fee was subsidized by the initial purchase, there's no need for the secondary owner to also subsidize the service. Reselling a game used doesn't increase the number of copies of a game out there or increase the strain on the company's servers.

And while it should be obvious, YES the server fee was subsidized and paid for by the initial purchases. If it wasn't then the company would have taken a massive hit to their bottom line by giving it away for free to all the initial buyers. And that would mean the shareholders will be considering who the next CEO will be sooner than you think.

[HammR25]

Looks like they were just referring to Playstation Plus.

http://www.atariage....77-psn-outline/

[Reaperman]

HammR25, on Wed Jun 16, 2010 7:57 AM, said:

Looks like they were just referring to Playstation Plus.

http://www.atariage....77-psn-outline/

I can really live with what they've done, even though I'm not their target market and won't be subscribing.
It targets the heaviest PSN users, that probably cost the most to support, and slips a fair fee on them, while providing some of the features that really appeal to a very heavy PSN user (like beta invites and 'moar gamez').

Somebody in sony's marketing department needs a raise, because this looks like a win/win. I can see the potential for this to turn evil, for example if demos stop coming out for standard users, but I'm as of now its a creative solution and I'll give it a chance.

Edited by Reaperman, Wed Jun 16, 2010 11:14 AM.

[cimerians]

Can they be any more vague?

"PlayStation Plus: PlayStation Network users will be able to purchase membership to PlayStation Plus; a new subscription service on the PlayStation Network that provides you with new options to expand and enhance your gaming experience and enable you to gain an exclusive set of features and content. Friendly reminder, all of you PlayStation Network users will continue to have free access to PlayStation Network’s unmatched and expanding suite of new and exclusive features while PlayStation Plus subscribers will gain access to an exclusive and expanding set of gaming features, content and functionality."


Taken from here:
psn blog

[Kid Ice]

cimerians, on Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:42 AM, said:

Can they be any more vague?

"PlayStation Plus: PlayStation Network users will be able to purchase membership to PlayStation Plus; a new subscription service on the PlayStation Network that provides you with new options to expand and enhance your gaming experience and enable you to gain an exclusive set of features and content. Friendly reminder, all of you PlayStation Network users will continue to have free access to PlayStation Network’s unmatched and expanding suite of new and exclusive features while PlayStation Plus subscribers will gain access to an exclusive and expanding set of gaming features, content and functionality."


Taken from here:
psn blog

From same blog:

Quote

First off, at launch, PlayStation Plus will offer subscribers the full PlayStation Network game, WipEout HD, PSP minis and PS One Classics such as Fieldrunners, Age of Zombies and Rally Cross, full game trial of inFAMOUS, as well as free monthly episodes of Qore – our high-definition, interactive gaming lifestyle show.

With that, here are the basics of the new subscription service that lives on top of the current PlayStation Network:

* The current PSN features will remain free. We are still very committed to PSN as a free comprehensive entertainment service and are certainly not planning on reducing this service following the launch of PlayStation Plus.
* PlayStation Plus is an evolving service and the features included at launch will be:
o Games
o PS Store Discounts
o Exclusive offers on select demos, betas and early purchases
o Full Game Trial
o Automatic Downloads

(More info on these below)
* PlayStation Plus can be purchased through PlayStation Store on PS3 as a one-year package or a three-month package. The three-month package is available for $17.99 and the one-year package will be available for $49.99. We will also be offering three additional bonus months for free if you purchase the 1-year package — that’s 15 months total for $49.99.
* Payment is a one-time fee for either package and can be purchased with any of the current PSN Store payment methods – credit card or PSN Cards.


Here are more details on the features of PlayStation Plus:

Games & Special Offers: As a subscriber, you can expect to get your hands on free monthly PSN games, minis and PS One Classics from the PSN Store. You will be able to download these games during the month they are available until the new selection replaces them.

Once downloaded, the games are yours to keep and play as long as you are a member of PlayStation Plus. If your subscription lapses and then you re-subscribe, the games you have already downloaded will reactivate, so you still have access to them. Additionally, if you delete one of the titles from your PS3, but decide you want to get it back, then you can re-download from the PlayStation Plus section of the PSN Store if the game is still there, or, if the game has expired from the PlayStation Plus section of the PSN Store, you can simply search for it on PS Store and download it again at no extra cost.

Each month there will be dynamic themes, premium avatars and premium game elements/add-ons for you to download and many will be exclusive to PlayStation Plus members only. These are yours to keep forever once you have downloaded them.

PlayStation Plus subscribers will also be given exclusive PlayStation Store discounts each month that are above and beyond the current PSN Store discounts available to everyone. These discounts will range from 20% to 50%, and anything you buy with these is yours to keep and enjoy forever.

Finally, wherever possible we’ll be making sure that members are included in selected demos and beta trials before they go live to everyone else, so you can be the one to tell all your friends about the next big game they ‘must’ get.

Subscribers will get hundreds of dollars of value through the year and, in the first month alone, will receive more than $50 worth of content.

Full Game Trial: Each month we will be offering members the chance to download full games and try them out for a period of time (one hour, unless otherwise stated). After the game trial is complete, simply purchase the game to carry on where you left off. This is a unique way to trial the full game experience and means you don’t have to be restricted to certain levels/game modes when you test out a game.

The games in Full Game Trial will become available to all PS Store users to purchase, but only PlayStation Plus members will have the chance to ‘try before you buy’.

The other great thing about this feature is that you can continue from where you were at the end of the trial period if you decide to buy the game. All game saves and trophies earned during the trial will be unlocked and will show up on your trophy list and your trophy level when you purchase the game. You don’t even have to re-download the game, just purchase and go back to the XMB to access the game.

Automatic Download: Subscribers will be able to set their PS3 to wake up from standby at any time of the day or night, download and install any game updates for the games you have been playing so you don’t have to think about it. Also, select demos and videos will be pushed to your PS3 ready to go. System software updates will also download automatically (manual install still required) and then the PS3 will turn itself off again.

Game updates and demos will also automatically install and the next time you turn on your PS3 you will see a brief on-screen message letting you know what has been downloaded and updated.

Here are some more answers to frequently asked questions from the last blog post:

* Cross-game voice chat is a feature we know our passionate user base has asked for and we’ll continue to look at as a viable offering for the PlayStation Network.
* You need to be the master account holder on the PS3 and be over 18 to purchase PlayStation Plus, but other accounts on that PS3 will be able to play the games you download for as long as you are a subscriber.
* The “free” games you can download each month are yours to keep for as long as you are a subscriber.
* PlayStation Plus is for PS3 owners as subscribership can only be purchased on the PSN Store. However, some of the content – minis and PS One Classics – available each month will also be playable on your PSP if you have one. Download them on the PS3 and transfer to your PSP, or download directly from the PSP Store or Media Go for PSP.

PlayStation Plus is a continually evolving service and we are always working on identifying new partnerships, developing new features and providing new content that our users want. So thanks again for all your comments and questions and please continue to offer more ideas at PlayStation.Blog Share.

[cimerians]

Yeah I read a lot more but not from them. Cause I want to know EXACTLY what I'm getting if I give them the money right now. I read it better here:

http://kotaku.com/55...laystation-plus

Also, I don't like this:
"Once downloaded, the games are yours to keep and play as long as you are a member of PlayStation Plus"

[wood_jl]

Maybe if you pay for PSN it won't suck like it did for PS2. It sucked having to register and log in for each and every game on PS2, sometimes with a different username that you'd have to write down because your usual one was taken. Had to maintain a clipboard. They also seemed to can the servers quickly. Xbox live on the 1st Xbox: even the earliest games still worked until they pulled the plug on Xbox1. If paying makes PSN like that, it will be a nice improvement.