30 replies to this topic

[Mark Wolfe]

I had a recent transaction go a little sour. I am still waiting for the shipment and the atariager I dealt with told me AFTER I paid $115 and AFTER the item did not show up that in fact the item was not his and that he did not handle the shipping and as far as he knew, it was shipped but he could not offer anymore information nor was any kind of tracking purchased as far as I can find out. I was given this 3rd party's phone number and told to go talk to him and to "chill". The 3rd party turned out to be hostile and acusatory when I asked simple questions regarding when exactly the item was shipped and if tracking was supplied.

I find it to be highly unethical for a seller here to list an item for sale when that item is not his/hers and the shipping will be handled by a 3rd party outside of AA and that primary information is withheld either on purpose or by accident.

I respect the system here, more so than Ebay or CL, and I put a lot of value into the reputations we all earn over time. When a seller uses that reputation to sell something only to then turn around after the transaction to say he/she has no obligation since it was not his/her item and he/she did not ship it.

I have to wonder now too if the testing the seller promised in the item description was even done by him since he did not own the console. The sale description clearly stated the console was tested and would be tested again for TWO HOURS prior to shipment. How can I possibly follow up with this transaction when the seller refuses to admit his obligation, so I ask all of you what you think:

Am I too close to this to see things reasonably or am I not asking for too much by expecting a seller here to supply all the facts of the items they sell including ownership and who will be handling the final aspects of the transaction?

Edited by Mark_Wolfe, Thu Mar 18, 2010 5:06 PM.

[Havok69]

Sounds like you got shafted. Hopefully everything works out in the end. Who was it? I'll make sure not to buy from them...

[jboypacman]

Mark i agree with you and yes if someone is selling something for someone else it should be noted but i also think if you are taking on the job of helping someone sell there items that you should also be responsible and be sure said the items are shipped on time,in proper packaging,ect.

In the end it is still the actual owner of sale items that is responsible but being a "middle man" for such things there is a spotlight put on you too.

[nonner242]

I would be pretty freaking mad if a seller didn't disclose that it was not his.
I think that that attitude of the person shoving to the 3rd party and not caring blows too...who is it!
I wounldn't buy from that person either....not very AAish.

[BDW]

Havok69, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 5:37 PM, said:

Sounds like you got shafted. Hopefully everything works out in the end. Who was it? I'll make sure not to buy from them...

nonner242, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 5:55 PM, said:

I think that that attitude of the person shoving to the 3rd party and not caring blows too...who is it!

*cough* flamingcowz *cough*


Man, I'm getting a nasty cold...

[Havok69]

Haha - you should get plenty of rest and fluids!

Looking at the dudes profile, he's 18 - if you can believe what he put. He's just a baby...

[STGuy1040]

Quote

Do you think it is the obligation of an AtariAge Marketplace Seller to tell people up front if what they are selling belongs to someone else and the shipping & handling of the item will be handled by the 3rd party?

Not only should it be the seller's responsibility, but it should be a rule of the Marketplace.

Edited by STGuy1040, Thu Mar 18, 2010 6:37 PM.

[nonner242]

brandondwright, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 5:58 PM, said:

Havok69, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 5:37 PM, said:

Sounds like you got shafted. Hopefully everything works out in the end. Who was it? I'll make sure not to buy from them...

nonner242, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 5:55 PM, said:

I think that that attitude of the person shoving to the 3rd party and not caring blows too...who is it!

*cough* flamingcowz *cough*


Man, I'm getting a nasty cold...

Man you dont sound good!
You should get some sleep....

[jsmith73]

It's wrong and unethical to broker a deal and then attempt to wash your hands of it when it goes sour.

I agree with STGuy; it should be a rule of the Marketplace. Even if it's an informal rule.

[jetset]

Clearly a dick move. The AA member should be added to the bad trader list for sure. Especially for telling you to "chill". That's just all sorts of wrong.
I would be interested hearing his side of the story, but I saw the thread about this. Pretty clear what happened, and Mark seems to have gotten deceived and shafted.

[CPUWIZ]

I didn't do it!

[hhwolfman]

CPUWIZ, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:36 PM, said:

I didn't do it!

I promised I wouldn't give em your name, Wiz. Really sorry about the Deal Wolf. That sucks.

[Cebus Capucinis]

CPUWIZ, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:36 PM, said:

I didn't do it!

I think you did.

That really sucks about the deal, though -- can't believe someone would do that. I honestly will be surprised if you even get a package at all.

[kheffington]

Seller is responsible for it and should refund your money if it isn't received.

If you used PayPal or other electronic payment, dispute it.

Edited by kheffington, Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:00 PM.

[Mark Wolfe]

A couple things that got me pissy about this aside from the revelation that the item was not being handled by the atariage member in good standing [so far] is that he ignored two polite messages I sent for a followup and the AA software showed him as being online and logged into messenger and reading the message. When I pointed this out, first he accused me of stalking him, then he made some excuse about checking it from his phone or handheld and how much a pain it is to write back... well, I get that but then why not send a quick message saying you'll address the question when you get home, not just ignore the message... but really that's bullshit because the AA software said the guy was typing a message as I viewed his profile and it was AFTER I messaged him twice and AFTER I waited for his reply which never came. I finally blew up after he was logged off well after 24hrs of waiting for a response to my two followups about the missing package.

soooo

the bottom line is, I told him he should apologize but he continued to be a dick and say he did nothing wrong.

which is what brought me here because I think it IS wrong and I see I'm not the only one.

I opened a paypal complaint and so far no package or response from the guy who got the paypal money, which by the way was given to me by the aforementioned atariager and he said: "here is my paypal/email" the word "MY" was used right before I paid. This would have been the perfect time for the douche to tell me he was referring to his friend's paypal not his.

-mw

[shadow460]

Should it be a rule? It should just be a given! Of the few sales I've made here, a few of them have been "brokered", however, I always make sure the buyer knows this and I never ask for money until the item is in my grubby little paws. If the deal goes sour, I'm fully willing to eat the cost of the item. That said, it certainly would suck to have to eat the cost of something expensive that I already have (LaserActive unit, for instance), so I'm kinda careful when I'm brokering a deal with stuff that's worth more than a few dollars.

As a matter of fact, I've got one deal similar to that now that's about to go south. I purchased the item locally and have it in my truck (should be up here in my grubby little paws but it's not), however the "buyer" has dropped the ball on me.

[flammingcowz]

Yo i'm the seller, I have sold on here before and have positive feedback. I have an ebay account that I actively sell on that has 100% feedback. I buy broken 360's, and re-sell them. My friend had an xbox he was trying to sell for a few months, so I decided to put what ones I had at that time, plus his into a thread in the marketplace. The 2 I had listed are already sold and have positive feedback on my ebay from them. The friend was at my house the time I posted it in the marketplace(that's how his 360 is in the picture), and was the one talking to the buyer the whole process, some(most?) of it taking place in my friends email address. He was the one that typed "MY".

My friend was telling me that he couldn't ship it out yet because he had no cash, and no way of getting his paypal money into cash at that time. He told me he had talked to the you(the buyer) through email and that it would be ok to ship it on his next payday. Well he got paid on a Friday, and was at my house the whole weekend. I asked him if he had shipped it and he said yes.

And dude, those 2 messages, I really WAS on an itouch, which are a bitch to type on(ask anyone that has used one), I was just getting on to see if my harmony cart had a tracking code yet. I saw your messages, and yes it was a stupid mistake not sending a simple reply like "i'll talk to you later" or something, but I just simply didn't think about it at the time.

So yes man, i'm sorry for the douche move, i'm sorry my friend probably shipped it to the wrong house, and i'm sorry to anyone that sees my reputation as hurt now. As I said I still actively buy and sell 360's and this is the only time i've had problems with it. It is also the only and last time I will try selling one for a friend, they just can't be as trust-worthy as you are.

[Mark Wolfe]

@shadow460: you are exactly the kind of atariager I would not think twice about entering into a deal with and it has as much to do with respecting your word as it does with the fact that you have created a reputation for yourself here. I would never even consider the notion that you would purposely screw me or I you. and I know based on your rep that you would do what you had to do to make it right just as I would.

I don't think the person I entered in to the deal with set out to screw me but when things went a little off, after I did not get the package when I expected and I followed up, the last thing I expected was for him to shrug off the responsibility and tell me to "chill". Yeah he's a young guy but he has been a member in good standing since 2004 and to me that counts for something. I take the people at their word here more than I would in other situations.

I do think think this should be a rule but I have no idea how it can be enforced other than to publicly call out anyone who breaks it and make them have their come to God moment, which I hope is what happens here. The seller started to tell me he would send me one of HIS consoles but then followed that by saying he would not since I was being such a hot head... but HE is the reason I'm hot headed because of his "douchery".

so I am left sitting and waiting on this package with no idea how or when it was sent or even IF it was sent and I'm out $115 with no guarantee the atariager in question will be motivated to make it right if the thing does not show up.

I do know now that I will be asking more questions than I used to when I next enter into a transaction and preface the questions with a link to this post.

[Mark Wolfe]

flammingcowz, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:02 PM, said:

The friend was at my house the time I posted it in the marketplace(that's how his 360 is in the picture), and was the one talking to the buyer the whole process, some(most?) of it taking place in my friends email address. He was the one that typed "MY".

yeah and you made NO attemopt to tell me it was not you, how the hell would I know someone was using your computer to type to me? you never said at ANY time hey, here's my friend who owns this and who is gonna ship it and who you are gonna pay because THEN I'd have all the facts.

edit: I'd like to point out too that I thought YOU were this "Harrison" person and that was your e-mail address. I don't know your name other than your AA username.

Quote

My friend was telling me that he couldn't ship it out yet because he had no cash, and no way of getting his paypal money into cash at that time. He told me he had talked to the you(the buyer) through email and that it would be ok to ship it on his next payday. Well he got paid on a Friday, and was at my house the whole weekend. I asked him if he had shipped it and he said yes.

this one REALLY annoys me because I use paypal to do online shipping all the time and use the paypal balance to pay for it and using that, then delivery confirmation IS FREE and it tracks right in paypal and everyone KNOWS where the fucking package is. the guy told me in between insulting me via txt message that he threw the receipt away.

Quote

And dude, those 2 messages, I really WAS on an itouch, which are a bitch to type on(ask anyone that has used one), I was just getting on to see if my harmony cart had a tracking code yet. I saw your messages, and yes it was a stupid mistake not sending a simple reply like "i'll talk to you later" or something, but I just simply didn't think about it at the time.

yeah well, you had ample time to tell me what was up and you chose not to and you have your reasons, I mean excuses so whatever dude... you led me astray and you had no remorse for it. nor did you bother to try to even stabalize the situation when you did finally email me, all you did was lay it on me that it was a friend, not you and you gave me his name and number and basically told me to go pound sand.

edit: you were checking on messages for your Harmony cart to see if it had tracking... how fucking IRONIC is that? tell me... what would your reaction be if no tracking was given and then no one returned your e-mail and then they told you, oh, we don't sell the harmony cart, we were just doing it for a friend and I "think" maybe they sent it but I don't know for sure... what the fuck would you do bro? eh?

Quote

So yes man, i'm sorry for the douche move, i'm sorry my friend probably shipped it to the wrong house, and i'm sorry to anyone that sees my reputation as hurt now. As I said I still actively buy and sell 360's and this is the only time i've had problems with it. It is also the only and last time I will try selling one for a friend, they just can't be as trust-worthy as you are.

I little too little too late. I don't have any room for an apology now, that time has passed, what I want is for you to step up and back up your sale here and assure me you will make it right if the xbox elite does not show up. if this wholoe thing boils down to a fucked up paypal dispute where I have to go after the money, then you WILL be added to the bad traders list and no one will want to deal with you here anymore without knowi8ng what you did and how you mishandled this whole thing.

Edited by Mark_Wolfe, Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:21 PM.

[flammingcowz]

Alright man, I hate bringing this out in public where every AA member can see, but it's how it has to be done.


you are very short tempered, self-centered, and creepy. i was very calm with you in the beginning, and you were just attacking me. I had told you if it wasn't there in a week that I would take care of it, and to just chill in the meantime. sometimes shipping takes longer than expected. you took EVERYTHING that was said the WRONG way. I answered every single one of your questions, even though they were asked multiple times. You still kept attacking me though. I know it isn't there yet, and stating the same things over and over, in multiple threads and in multiple PM's won't solve that. I told you to wait a fucking week and we'll see what happens. I had another 360 sitting in my room I was going to ship to you but because of your inability to control your anger, and your inability to handle private matters in a private way, that 360 has already been sold and shipped. So what was your last request? an apology. and I gave you another very sincere one, in another very calm manner. And you still attacked me. So put me on the bad traders list, and dispute those paypal cases. You are a very bad person to deal with. I hope these words keep you up tonight -you have mental problems-

[Mark Wolfe]

flammingcowz, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:20 PM, said:

Alright man, I hate bringing this out in public where every AA member can see, but it's how it has to be done.


you are very short tempered, self-centered, and creepy. i was very calm with you in the beginning, and you were just attacking me. I had told you if it wasn't there in a week that I would take care of it, and to just chill in the meantime. sometimes shipping takes longer than expected. you took EVERYTHING that was said the WRONG way. I answered every single one of your questions, even though they were asked multiple times. You still kept attacking me though. I know it isn't there yet, and stating the same things over and over, in multiple threads and in multiple PM's won't solve that. I told you to wait a fucking week and we'll see what happens. I had another 360 sitting in my room I was going to ship to you but because of your inability to control your anger, and your inability to handle private matters in a private way, that 360 has already been sold and shipped. So what was your last request? an apology. and I gave you another very sincere one, in another very calm manner. And you still attacked me. So put me on the bad traders list, and dispute those paypal cases. You are a very bad person to deal with. I hope these words keep you up tonight -you have mental problems-

umm, the only person this makes look bad is YOU douchey. seriously dude, you have no idea what you are doing or any clue as to what "my word is my bond" means.

this is exactly the kind of belligerent behavior I was referring to, first in your "friend" and now YOU.

next time why not make the font size larger and use all caps.

and yeah, I did take everything you said the wrong way because everything you said was...

[can I get a witness?]

WRONG!!!

edit: btw: it has been over a week, I paid on the 8th of March. you never really did tell me you would take care of it, what you told me was you were gonna tell me you were gonna take care of it but since I was being so umm, how did you put it? creepy or whatever, that you wouldn't bother, so that makes it seem like I was the one who fucked up when we all know it was you, and your stupid belligerent friend.

this reminds me of when ebay used to allow sellers to leave buyers neg feedback. buyers have one job... TO BUY and PAY. that's it. if we did not sell to dickweeds and creeps our economy would crash. I admit to being a hot head but it is mostly due to having no patience for idiocy and my mother always telling me never to suffer fools, so there ya have it.

all you have to do is step up and do the right thing. playtime is over. I paid... where is my shit?

Edited by Mark_Wolfe, Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:33 PM.

[flammingcowz]

How about you prove it's not already at your house? I can take my friends word - who i've known half my life - or the word of someone online. He says he shipped it, you're saying he hasn't.

Would you believe a family member or a strange man with a gun?

EDIT: I would like other peoples opinions on this now that both sides have been stated.

Edited by flammingcowz, Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:32 PM.

[Mark Wolfe]

flammingcowz, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:30 PM, said:

How about you prove it's not already at your house? I can take my friends word - who i've known half my life - or the word of someone online. He says he shipped it, you're saying he hasn't.

Would you believe a family member or a strange man with a gun?

EDIT: I would like other peoples opinions on this now that both sides have been stated.

douche move number two.

blame ME for your fucked up way of handling this.

nice.

Glenn Beck would be proud

how about you prove that you shipped it... oh wait, YOU didn't ship it did you? yet you listed it and wrote to me... oh wait, you didn't write to me, your friend did... oh gee now how do I figure this out?

edit: btw, wasn't you who posted a few posts back that he probably used the wrong address? you said it as if you would not put it past him. where is the receipt? where is the documentation that it was shipped, what did he use to label the package? where did he take it? how was it shipped? priority mail would be here by now bro

Edited by Mark_Wolfe, Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:42 PM.

[Mark Wolfe]

brandondwright, on Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:34 PM, said:

Give it a clicky to see the wondrous animation!

ibtl_2.gif



Thanks, Shawn.

This discussion should be kept up and not locked. this gets at the root of what we're all about here, our reputations and our word.

[flammingcowz]

talking to him right now...

Quote

him11:36 pm
(11:36:41 PM): Yo.

PPL I Dont Hate 11:36 pm
(11:36:59 PM): yo
(11:37:00 PM): im pissed

[b]him[/b11:37 pm
(11:37:05 PM): ?

PPL I Dont Hate 11:37 pm
(11:37:11 PM): apparently I owe this dude 115 dollars
(11:37:16 PM): because i posted your 360 in my thread

[b]him[/b11:37 pm
(11:37:16 PM): Why?
(11:37:23 PM): So?
(11:37:34 PM): It's probably at his house.

PPL I Dont Hate 11:38 pm
(11:38:09 PM): are you 100% positive you shipped it to the right place, and on friday

[b]him[/b11:38 pm
(11:38:28 PM): Yeah.

Edited by flammingcowz, Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:43 PM.