38 replies to this topic

[PAC-MAN PRIME]

So now that Metroid: Other M has been out for some time, what is the verdict? Do you like the new game format better than Metroid Prime's first person adventure? Do you wish they would have stuck with the Metroid Prime game play? Do you love the Prime series, but are you glad the new game is something different and new?

[Cybergoth]

I think I'd like to see the Prime gameplay combined with the storytelling of Other M

[Emehr]

I love the Metroid series and have played and beaten almost all of them but I haven't played Other M. The characterization of Samus was completely not what I expected (and I only know what I know based on reviews). It kinda turned me off to the whole thing. That and I really don't like intermissions in modern games. The short between-stage monologues in Fusion were fine but I'm not a fan of voice acting in modern games mainly because most of it is terrible and doesn't match up with the puppet-looking CG characters. If someone told me that things turned around in Other M and that Samus wasn't emo all the way through I may give it a try.

[cimerians]

Other M is pretty cool but I pick the Prime series. Besides, Samus talks too much in other M.

[PAC-MAN PRIME]

cimerians, on Wed Nov 10, 2010 8:11 AM, said:

Other M is pretty cool but I pick the Prime series. Besides, Samus talks too much in other M.

I feel the same way about it. I like Other M, but to be totally honest, it feels like a step back from the Prime series. Still a fun game though. But I think the Prime series is better and actually truer to traditional Metroid in many aspects.

[rockman_x_2002]

Other M was a nice diversion, but Prime just feels more like a proper Metroid title in the same style as the older Nintendo outings.

[cimerians]

PAC-MAN PRIME, on Wed Nov 10, 2010 9:20 AM, said:

cimerians, on Wed Nov 10, 2010 8:11 AM, said:

Other M is pretty cool but I pick the Prime series. Besides, Samus talks too much in other M.

I feel the same way about it. I like Other M, but to be totally honest, it feels like a step back from the Prime series. Still a fun game though. But I think the Prime series is better and actually truer to traditional Metroid in many aspects.

Yup, Other M just didn't feel like Metroid at certain times. The sad thing is that maybe Prime will never return. I hope so, I liked all three even though the first two were unforgiving for me (backtracking and difficulty).

Is Prime forever dead?

[StanJr]

Prime was revolutionary and totally blew me away while keeping with the Metroid vibe. Other M was really fun and great, but also very short and the addition of "story" really detracted from the overall fun and did not gel with the Metroid vibe.

[Pixelboy]

I've only played a couple of hours with Other M at a friend's place and didn't get very far, but there are certain things that annoy me with Other M that made me vote for the Prime series in this poll:

- I don't like how the game artificially confines your movement in certain areas. Like when there's plantlife all around you, but you can't really touch it because you're bound to a wavy linear track between exits. It feels like lazy design to me, especially after being able to explore every nook and cranny in the Prime series.

- There's not enough stuff to scan in Other M. My complaint with the Prime series was that there was too many things to scan, but at least it made me learn to appreciate scanning the environments. In Other M, there are many elements that could have made interesting scanning subjects, but the scanner doesn't have anything to say about them. Scanning seems to be mostly used for locating secret areas and items, which is fine, but it left me wanting for more.

- I don't really have a problem with the intermissions in Other M, except for the fact that they made Samus a little wussy. It's like Other M's designers took that moment in Metroid II where Samus refrains from killing the Metroid hatchling out of compassion, and just extrapolated her entire personality from that single event. The intermissions in Metroid Fusion (mostly those that relate to Adam) also played a part in defining Samus' personality in Other M, obviously. This doesn't feel right to me. The Samus I know is colder and more bad-ass than that. The Samus I know wouldn't have agreed to follow Adam's orders in Other M like a happy little soldier, she would just have kept to herself and tried to stay out of the way of Adam's team on the Bottle Ship, while maintaining a minimum amount of communication to share information.

[cimerians]

Pixelboy, on Thu Nov 11, 2010 5:51 AM, said:

I've only played a couple of hours with Other M at a friend's place and didn't get very far, but there are certain things that annoy me with Other M that made me vote for the Prime series in this poll:

- I don't like how the game artificially confines your movement in certain areas. Like when there's plantlife all around you, but you can't really touch it because you're bound to a wavy linear track between exits. It feels like lazy design to me, especially after being able to explore every nook and cranny in the Prime series.

- There's not enough stuff to scan in Other M. My complaint with the Prime series was that there was too many things to scan, but at least it made me learn to appreciate scanning the environments. In Other M, there are many elements that could have made interesting scanning subjects, but the scanner doesn't have anything to say about them. Scanning seems to be mostly used for locating secret areas and items, which is fine, but it left me wanting for more.

- I don't really have a problem with the intermissions in Other M, except for the fact that they made Samus a little wussy. It's like Other M's designers took that moment in Metroid II where Samus refrains from killing the Metroid hatchling out of compassion, and just extrapolated her entire personality from that single event. The intermissions in Metroid Fusion (mostly those that relate to Adam) also played a part in defining Samus' personality in Other M, obviously. This doesn't feel right to me. The Samus I know is colder and more bad-ass than that. The Samus I know wouldn't have agreed to follow Adam's orders in Other M like a happy little soldier, she would just have kept to herself and tried to stay out of the way of Adam's team on the Bottle Ship, while maintaining a minimum amount of communication to share information.

I completely agree with you on every point! Especially what you said about scanning.

I was really disappointed in the lack of scanning and "exploration" of Other M. Prime felt like I can explore every inch of the world and scan everything. I also thought it was a bit much but I appreciated the love and effort those guys put into the Prime series so I couldn't fault them for it. It was great reading and scanning things. Sometimes thats all I would do before heading back to the mission.

[Emehr]

Is there anything in Other M that makes it uniquely Metroid? The Prime series flawlessly captured the gameplay elements established by the original Metroid and Super Metroid. Is there any trace of these games in Other M? If the artwork were replaced by something completely different and names changed, could Other M had been a different game altogether? To me it sounds very linear, the acquisition of items has been...uh...re-imagined, and we get a protagonist who doesn't sound like the butt-kicking bounty hunter we think we should know. I can live with having a story to flesh out the characters (I was actually looking forward to it), but I can't accept the game-play getting butchered to accommodate it.

So, other than a completely unexpected characterization of the lead character, what does Other M have to offer the Metroid series that couldn't be experienced in the other games? Maybe I should just rent it and be done with it. I just don't want to be too disappointed.

[StanJr]

not too much, Emehr, unless you are really looking for character changing storyline. It feels to me like Prime: Lite.

Still fun and a good installment in the series, but you can miss it and not be worse off. (like the PS2 Castlevanias)

[Pixelboy]

StanJr, on Thu Nov 11, 2010 4:37 PM, said:

not too much, Emehr, unless you are really looking for character changing storyline. It feels to me like Prime: Lite.

Still fun and a good installment in the series, but you can miss it and not be worse off. (like the PS2 Castlevanias)

Agreed.

The thing is, once you've really mastered the controls, and can perform every available special move at will, the game becomes quite easy. That's what my friend told me anyway, I didn't reach that level of mastery myself.

So you're better off renting it for a few days, if you're not a rabid Metroid fan.

[MagitekAngel]

The original Metroid Prime is one of my all-time favorite games, definitely in my top 5 at least. That being said, by the time the third installment rolled around, I felt the (sub) series was getting stale.

So while maybe Metroid Other M will never be on any of my best-of lists, I still appreciate that Nintendo is still trying to innovate.

[Emehr]

StanJr, on Thu Nov 11, 2010 4:37 PM, said:

not too much, Emehr, unless you are really looking for character changing storyline. It feels to me like Prime: Lite.

Still fun and a good installment in the series, but you can miss it and not be worse off. (like the PS2 Castlevanias)

Hmm, I think I'll skip it then. Or wait until a price drop. I've only skipped one other Metroid game (Hunters) so that's not too bad of a track record for the series. I hope the developers can get back on track for the next installment. I'd love to see a 2D Metroid for the DS.

[Tr3vor]

No doubt about it, Prime kicks M's ass. especially Metroid Prime Trilogy.

[Shawn Sr.]

Other M is the best metroid game since Super Metroid on the SNES (IMO).

[Cybergoth]

This video perfectly sums up my thoughts regarding some of the "issues" a lot of people seem to have with Other M (especially those who actually haven't even played it):

http://gameoverthink...to-metroid.html

[Mendon]

Thanks for posting that link, Cyber. I thought the commentator gave an interesting and reasonable view of the complaints many have with the game.

For myself, the only thing within the game that really bothered me was the "Adam has authorized it yet" scenario's. As an example, I was running thru a lava area and taking constant health damage because of the heat. At almost the very end of the level, Adam finally tells me that I can put on my heat suit. Nice guy!

Having to find a part to get my heat suit in full working order is a reasonable plot development, even if its a plot point that has been used before. But to have a fully functional suit and not use it, even though I'm dying, because some guy doesn't want me to use it, isn't a reasonable plot development, in my thinking.

Overall, I enjoyed Other M... I wasn't turned off by giving Samus a voice or a history and I found the gameplay fun and challenging. And I don't feel it was a mistake to change the gameplay style of Other M from the success of the Prime Trilogy anymore than it was a mistake to change the gameplay style of Metroid Prime from the success of Metroid and Super Metroid.

Nintendo always seems ready to take some risks..... changing Metroid from a side scroller to an FPS; giving us a cell-shaded Link; changing Donkey Kong or Mario from simple platformers to full 3D world adventures; changing the entire look of Kirby and the world he dwells in; going from analog control to motion; and on and on. Sometimes these changes are met with hesitation by the consumer but then are accepted as a fun way to game; sometimes these changes just don't work (looking at Star Fox Adventures).

Maybe at some point, Other M will be ushered into the Metroid family with happy and grateful arms; or maybe it never will.

Mendon

[Mendon]

In a GoNintendo article........


The following information comes from Reggie Fils-Aime...

"We believe that it (Metroid: Other M) could be, should be a million unit title. We're not going to get there, not through the holiday. And we are doing a lot of thinking as to why. Because it's a great game. The consumer reaction because of the quality has been strong. We're doing a lot of thinking about why we didn't get there. I think the marketing was strong, advertising was very good, the social media we did was very positive. (It's) getting close to half a million."

Reggie went on to discuss the dev team, as well as the voice acting...

"First off, [I have] nothing but the greatest respect for the development team. Mr. Sakamoto [co-creator of Metoid] did a wonderful job. His partnership with us in promoting the game was stellar. Team Ninja [is] absolutely fabulous. I'm not going to sit here and criticize a style of the game, but have I read the same feedback that said, broadly, that the portrayal of Samus felt different than how the player in the past had internalized the character? I've heard and read the same feedback. Do I think it's warranted or not? I'm not quite sure yet... I don't yet believe that that is the driving factor to the performance of the game."

Even with all this negativity, the series is going to continue on...right?

"I certainly hope so. I'm a passionate fan of Samus and the Metroid series."



Mendon

[Pixelboy]

Cybergoth, on Sat Nov 13, 2010 3:37 AM, said:

This video perfectly sums up my thoughts regarding some of the "issues" a lot of people seem to have with Other M (especially those who actually haven't even played it):

http://gameoverthink...to-metroid.html

Very nice video, but I think mister "overthinker" is missing the point. It's true that Samus has always been a "robot" of sorts, causing us gamers to fill in the blanks about her personality. But let me ask you this: How many successful video games series let us do that to such an extent? A video game series where an entire world is created, an entire complex storyline is forged around a galactic threat (let it be Metroids, Space Pirates or Phazon) without actually taking the time to define the main hero's personality in relation to this threat? There have been many such series, actually, I'm sure you can name a few (Contra, Castlevania and Ghost'n Goblins comes to my mind) but most of the time there's a storyline plot point that explains why the heroes are there (you're a soldier presumably acting under orders in Contra, and you're a descendant of the Belmont clan in Castlevania). Most of the time, such "heroes" are men, so automatically we assume that there's this sense of "duty" and "respect for hierarchy" that defines the character and sets the stage for their mission. We don't need to define the personality of the hero, we just borrow a page from the "military duty handbook", apply it to the hero, and then we tackle the real problem, which is how to survive and fulfill the game's objective(s).

Out of habit, we gamers also applied the "military duty handbook" to Samus Aran, since she's a bounty hunter and all, but there's a slight difference here: There's no real hierarchy that overshadows Samus' activities (the exception being Metroid Fusion). As a lone bounty hunter, Samus can leave the planet/space station/whatever in her gunship any time she wants, in theory. The way the story is usually set up in the Metroid games, SHE sticks around because SHE wants to. Or rather, the game itself doesn't let us leave, because all that keeps Samus from leaving is her pure sense of duty, and her need to get the job completely done. And the fact that she's a woman only serves to solidify the respect that we have for this particular hero character.

We gamers took that "robot placeholder" female character that Nintendo created, and collectively defined a personality for her. This personality wasn't defined by game manuals, or by in-game intermissions. It wasn't even infered by the fact that she's a woman. It was defined strictly by her accomplishments: She ventured into dangerous and unexplored territories, faced hordes of nightmarish alien creatures, stood up to powerful monsters several times her own human size, and she survived it all powered only by her sense of duty towards galactic peace. In my book, that's the very definition of a bad-ass hero, regardless of gender. And we're supposed to believe that Samus Aran is NOT fearless? That she's NOT stoic in the face of danger, even in the smallest degree?

The point I'm trying to make is that Samus has always been OURS, in terms of character definition. From one Metroid game to the next, we collectively reached a consensus about what her personality is like, and Retro Studios respected this consensus when they created the Prime series. Now a small band of japanese game designers sitting comfortably in their ivory tower comes along and assign a backstory to OUR hero, giving her feelings and doubts that clash terribly with our collective consensus, and we're supposed to say "Okay, I guess we didn't know Samus like we thought we did"? Off with their heads, I say!!!

I'm not saying that it was wrong to define a back-story for Samus. In fact, personally, I've been waiting for years for Nintendo to properly define her back-story via an official installment in the Metroid series. But there's just something fondamentaly wrong about how they went about it in Other M, and given the general online response to this particular issue, I'd say I'm not alone with this perception. It's okay to define a back-story for Samus, to give her memories and experiences that help us better understand where she came from, who she is and what makes her tick, but when OUR hero character is practically redefined (dare I say even re-imagined) to the point where she acts in ways that are uncharacteristic of her, I'm sorry but I can't help but cry foul.

So after Other M, our previous collective definition and perception of Samus Aran was wrong because, what, we're not game designers working for Nintendo? I say owning a copyright/trademark over a game character doesn't mean you can do whatever you want with this character and not expect a backlash reaction from fans, especially for a hero character like Samus Aran. No, Nintendo didn't previously "define" Samus Aran like they usually do with their other video game hero characters, we Metroid fans defined it. And I say this definition is just as valid and as solid as anything Nintendo could come up with, especially since this character definition was reached by general consensus, based mostly on Samus' accomplishments in the many games she starred in.

Basically, they crossed a line they shouldn't have crossed, and I think they genuinely deserve the complaints they're getting for it. And the ironic thing is that these complaints would never have surfaced if they had simply made a few minor adjustments to the in-game intermissions in Other M, in order to make Samus a little more independent towards Adam.

[StanJr]

I think it is pretty telling that they are not seeing the sales they expected from this title and Samus' character is at the heart of the matter. My other big gripe is that they game is short, very short. 10 hours. I'm not asking for 70, but can I get 30? Prime was LONG and fun. Took me every bit of 25-30 hours. Even with the short epilogue mission, M was 10 hours.

Aimee has a fun take on the whole thing, from a girl's perspective no less:
Metroid Other M

[Christophero Sly]

It seems to me that the weak sales of Other M have little to do with any specific aspect of the game, such as Samus' portrayal, and everything to do with the fact that the game just isn't the type of game the Wii's core demographic (casual gamers) are interested in, so they didn't buy it. Other M's audience is playing the 360 and PS3.

[George35]

Other M is a great game, but maybe not a great Metroid game. I would like to see another Metroid game done in this style, but with several improvements. Notably, have a zoom out feature, that when enemies are present in the room and off screen, the camera should zoom out some to keep them in view. It happens in open areas, but in hallways it seems you are running blindly. Also, along the same line, the perspective does not change. On some passages where you are running toward the screen you have a great view, but come back down the same hall and you are running toward the screen, completely blind. It would be nice if the view were always behind Samus, or if the camera rotated so it was always left-right.

I've heard several complaints about how power ups are unlocked in this game, but I actually like the way this was done. It always bugged me that in the beginning of every other Metroid your weapons are mysteriously gone and you have to go about powering up again, or something happens in the beginning that causes you to lose your powers. But, am I correct in noticing that this is the only Metroid where there is no sign or mention of the Chozo? Seems a bit odd for a title that was supposed to expand on Samus' background...

[StanJr]

Christophero Sly, on Sat Nov 13, 2010 11:35 AM, said:

the Wii's core demographic (casual gamers)

I cannot disagree with this more. You cannot create a successful platform that is to be primarily supported by people who have nothing more than a passing interest in the genre. The casual gamer is what vaulted Wii to the top, but they are not Nintendo's core demographic. (this is actually a more accurate assessment of the DS, but again I do not think it holds.) You can't sell many cars to people who only drive every now and then.