30 replies to this topic

[Curt Vendel]

I have been working extensively with the former researchers from Atari's various Corporate Research & Development labs and during the course of this extensive research, along with unpacking everything into the new Atari Museum office and archival room, 2 mysterious peripherals were discovered that were in Atari 850 interface cases....

Turns out these are actual Network modules that allowed Atari 800's to connect together into a network, this was done in 1983!

This section is in the process of being setup and a lot more data will be added this coming weekend, but here is a sneak peak for everyone:

The Atari Corporate Research Labs @ The Atari Museum:

http://www.atarimuse...ects/lalab.html



Curt

[Thelen]

AAAH ! your link sin't working !

Thelen

[Curt Vendel]

Fixed!

[Gregory DG]

Since you do mention PARC and this is about Atari networking, you might also want to mention that PARC developed Ethernet too (as a faster way to get data to their fancy new laser printers.)

Got that info from the Book/video set of Triumph of the Nerds by Bob Cringely.

God, I love computer history!

[DanBoris]

Do you have any tech info on the network module? I have been studying the pictures on the site and a dis-assembly of the ROM images. I am really interested in finding out how these things worked.

Dan

[Curt Vendel]

Hi Greg,

Yeah, I'm planning on re-writing some of the info on the page to mention Bob Metcalf's invention of Ethernet while at PARC, and change the mentioning of the Mouse as that was done at SRI, not PARC and add a few additional historical references.


Triumph is good, a better book to read if you really want to get into some great history is NERDS 2.0.1 "A Brief History of the Internet" Which tells of how ARPAnet got started, the design of the IMP (Pre-Routers) about PARC, Ethernet, CISCO, 3Com and goes onto in Novell, MS, IBM and so forth, well worth reading.


Curt

[Curt Vendel]

Hi Dan,

The H/W designer and S/W designer are each getting back to me with more info and hopefully with schematics and software too which I'll add. This was directed under Alan Kay and I have an email into him (now over at HP as their Chief Technologist) and see if he might be able to expand more on it as well.



Curt

[DanBoris]

I've been digging through a disassembly of the ROMs you posted on your site for these, and discovered that like the 850 interface module, these units did have driver code built in that got downloaded to the computer. I even found the code that does the download, but I can't find where this code is called, so it's possible it doesn't work.

I'm having fun trying to figure out how these things worked!

Dan

[Curt Vendel]

Glenn Bruner and I have been digging through the code quite a bit and the driver is there, but there no auto-load call to bring it into the system memory like the 850.

Glenn has disassembled it and I'll post his progress, I'm going to try and manually load the code into memory and see what happens.


Curt

[tyranthraxus]

I've seen that Triumph of the Nerds documentary on tv but not the
book. Its a great series and so is the Internet one but it is a bit
annoying that all he covers is the Apple vs IBM story. There is really
no mention of Atari or Commodore who each had large market shares
throughout the 80s and the early 90s. The failure of the Amiga and ST
is a worthy one as much as Apple's decline from 80s glory.

John

[Bill Lange]

Curt -

Your top link doesn't seem to be working.

WRL

[Curt Vendel]

Had a problem yesterday with an inside port on the firewall, seems to have failed, so when I got home last night I switched ports and ordered a replacement firewall incase the unit is beginning to show signs of full failure. Site is back up.


Curt

[Curt Vendel]

Just added a lot more documentation into the Atari Corporate Research Lab section:


http://www.atarimuse...ects/lalab.html



Curt

[TXG/MNX]

Whow! I really hope you get these network cards to work, I quickly looked at the chips that are used and I think all of them still are available...

The network adapters use a serial protocol because there is an 6850 acia inside. Maybe when you know how it should work, a compatible adapter coude be made...

I really am interested in the protocoll Atari wanted to use for the network...

TXG/MNX

[TXG/MNX]

Whow! I really hope you get these network cards to work, I quickly looked at the chips that are used and I think all of them still are available...

The network adapters use a serial protocol because there is an 6850 acia inside. Maybe when you know how it should work, a compatible adapter coude be made...

I really am interested in the protocoll Atari wanted to use for the network...

TXG/MNX

[David_P]

Bumping a necro-thread here, but I've always found networking fascinating.

I've doe a bit of assessment of the ALAN-K (Atari Local Area Network model K) information Curt has up on his site (http://www.atarimuse...earch/alan.html), trying to figure it out, and possibly build my own compatible devices.

(1) The CPU is a 6502. Therefore, the 2K RAM (a 2016) will map to $0000-$07FF, to provide page 0 and the stack (page 1). The 6502 requires valid addresses at $FFFA for the NMI, $FFFC for powerup, and $FFFE for IRQ service, so the 4K ROM (a 2732 EPROM) will map to $F000-$FFFF.

(2) There are two 6850 serial controllers, one is for the SIO line and the other for the network. Datasheet is available at http://pdf1.alldatas...OLA/MC6850.html, and the ICs are available at http://futurlec.com/IC6800Series.shtml

(3) There's a 6532 RIOT. I am not certain what it is used for in the design.


For me, the next step is to disassemble one of the ROMs to figure out the memory map, and then understand how the device works.

[Mathy]

Hello David

Am I correct in assuming, that the ALAN-K device is to be the first device in the daisy-chain of each networked computer and that you need one ALAN-K device per computer that is to be networked? And that the ALAN-K devices are interconnected via the two ports on the upper left corner of picture number two and three on Curt's page?

greetings

Mathy (who's also always been interested in networking Atari 8 bit computers via either SIO or PBI, not via cartridge port or joystick)

PS if the answer to my questions is yes --> ME WANT!!!

[David_P]

Mathy, on Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:36 AM, said:

Hello David

Am I correct in assuming, that the ALAN-K device is to be the first device in the daisy-chain of each networked computer and that you need one ALAN-K device per computer that is to be networked? And that the ALAN-K devices are interconnected via the two ports on the upper left corner of picture number two and three on Curt's page?

greetings

Mathy (who's also always been interested in networking Atari 8 bit computers via either SIO or PBI, not via cartridge port or joystick)

PS if the answer to my questions is yes --> ME WANT!!!

My understanding is that one is needed per computer, with each having a distinct address set by the switches inside the interface. From the remainder of the text on the page, plus the "trip report" at the bottom, it sounds like there must be a loop between the computers, using the two ports on top.

Once I have a bit more time I'm going to disassemble the ROMs and figure out how it works. From the trip report it sounds like there were very few people in Atari who knew how they were supposed to work, making it a challenge to set up.

[evilmoo]

David_P, on Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:07 AM, said:

Once I have a bit more time I'm going to disassemble the ROMs and figure out how it works. From the trip report it sounds like there were very few people in Atari who knew how they were supposed to work, making it a challenge to set up.

I started on the 'B09' ROM. It appears that there is some sort of host driver for it starting at offset $C00 in the ROM. I will post a link to my repository as soon as I get it online.

[Havok69]

Thanks for bumping this old thread - I was never aware of this product. Seeing yet another innovative device that was shelved really makes me wonder where the real Atari would be today if only they had proper management...

[evilmoo]

I haven't had time to comment or label much, but here's a start:

http://git.cluephone...alank;a=summary

[tregare]

evilmoo, on Fri Jun 18, 2010 2:44 PM, said:

I haven't had time to comment or label much, but here's a start:

http://git.cluephone...alank;a=summary

the billion dollar question. has a schematic been made of it yet?

[David_P]

No schematic that I know - step 1 is to figure out the device, step 2 would be to docuemnt it so people can design and make compatible devices.

It would probably be possible to build a "new" device with a single AVR... much smaller, and easier.

[Mathy]

Hello guys

Is somebody still working on this?

sincerely

Mathy

[David_P]

Life has a funny way of disrupting things. But now that my home's foundation has been repaired, and the roof has been replaced, I'll be able to set up my Atari room again, and resume looking at such things. Assuming work, work #2 and my wife leave me some spare time...