262 replies to this topic

[SpiceWare]

jbs30000, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 11:11 AM, said:

I was working on a 2600 Space Harrier game last year. It wasn't half bad, but a few months ago my hard drive crashed and I had no backups, so it's all gone now.

Next time start a blog and upload your source files to it. If you want to keep the project private, then just leave the blog entries in draft mode. Makes for a handy off-site backup, it's what I do.

[RevEng]

I'm a command-line junkie... In my case I just issue a "make backup" command, and it prompts me for a description of what's been changed. Then the current directory gets packaged up and mailed to my gmail account as an attachment. The description gets put in the body of the email, so I can tell figure out which backup I need to restore from, should the need arise.

Sadly, I set it up after a disaster similar to jbs30000's drive failure, not before. But I try not to make the same mistake twice.

Whatever system you use, be it emailing, copying to an external drive, posting to a blog, etc., it needs to be setup so its brain-dead easy to do. Otherwise you'll skip it the time you most need it.

And in case batari doesn't check the thread prior to the page flip, there are 2 tiny bugs outstanding in the bB 1.1 beta.

[potatohead]

Lost the code to the final version Of Ooze! that way. Thought I had archived it, but didn't. Still pisses me off.

I also upload code to various places on the net. Code is generally small, and it's easy to stash online. Frequently, I'll find myself on different computers too. Very nice to just put the code up, and fetch it onto the machine in use that day.

Don't put code archives on USB keys. Thought that was a good idea, until another family member lost the key, or erased it to store pictures, or upload music to the PS3...

Edited by potatohead, Sat Feb 5, 2011 5:27 PM.

[Random Terrain]

RevEng, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 5:18 PM, said:

I'm a command-line junkie... In my case I just issue a "make backup" command, and it prompts me for a description of what's been changed. Then the current directory gets packaged up and mailed to my gmail account as an attachment. The description gets put in the body of the email, so I can tell figure out which backup I need to restore from, should the need arise.

Uploading is good, but I'd also like to have a computer that has two hard drives of the same size. Whatever you do would get put on both hard drives automatically. I know you can't trust hard drives, but they probably wouldn't die at the same time, so you'd have a chance to rescue the latest files you haven't uploaded yet.

Edited by Random Terrain, Sat Feb 5, 2011 7:58 PM.

[SpiceWare]

Random Terrain, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 5:50 PM, said:

Uploading is is good, but I'd also like to have a computer that has two hard drives of the same size. Whatever you do would get put on both hard drives automatically. I know you can't trust hard drives, but they probably wouldn't die at the same time, so you'd have a chance to rescue the latest files you haven't uploaded yet.

Time Machine on the Mac is perfect for this. I still like offsite though.

[atari2600land]

Ten sprites is really cool! Is this a stable release that can replace all my 1.0 files? And when will there be AtariVox support for bB?

[RevEng]

There's still a few bugs, and there's no score feature yet.

At this point its good enough to start a project in, but you'll want to upgrade as batari puts out updates. And don't replace your main bB build with it yet either.

AtariVox is a simple add-in, and doesn't need to be part of the bB distribution... I've added preliminary Vox support to 21 Blue (no sounds programmed yet), and once I get my hands on one and play around, I'll write up how to use it in bB.

[Random Terrain]

RevEng, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 7:21 PM, said:

AtariVox is a simple add-in, and doesn't need to be part of the bB distribution... I've added preliminary Vox support to 21 Blue (no sounds programmed yet), and once I get my hands on one and play around, I'll write up how to use it in bB.

When you do, please let me know in case I miss it so I can put it on the bB page.

[yuppicide]

Maybe one day we'll get a version of SPACE TAXI on the 2600 with tons of levels.

[Random Terrain]

SpiceWare, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 5:56 PM, said:

Random Terrain, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 5:50 PM, said:

Uploading is good, but I'd also like to have a computer that has two hard drives of the same size. Whatever you do would get put on both hard drives automatically. I know you can't trust hard drives, but they probably wouldn't die at the same time, so you'd have a chance to rescue the latest files you haven't uploaded yet.

Time Machine on the Mac is perfect for this. I still like offsite though.

Speaking of this kind of thing, I was just given a Seagate GoFlex FreeAgent external hard drive. It came with Memeo Instant Backup and it's backing stuff up right now. When it gets done, it says it will constantly keep my files backed up:

"Files are instantly and automatically protected. No need for manual or scheduled backups. Memeo Instant Backup will back up any new or changed file instantly and automatically. Once you set your backup plan you never have to look at it again."

"If your storage device isn’t connected, don’t worry, Memeo’s LifeAgent™ Technology will keep track of new or changed files and back them up when your storage device is reconnected."

Edited by Random Terrain, Sat Feb 5, 2011 7:59 PM.

[Jess Ragan]

When this is finished, could someone put it in a ZIP file with all the modules in their proper directories, so it's not necessary to go through the frustrating process of doing it manually?

[Philsan]

yuppicide, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 7:43 PM, said:

Maybe one day we'll get a version of SPACE TAXI on the 2600 with tons of levels.

With new kernel not only graphics could be better but also the 10 sprites could help to replicate levels.

[Philsan]

BTW, Fred has to add score in the new kernel.
Perhaps in the past you already talked about the fact that score isn't centered.
Will this problem be fixed or is it impossible?

[Random Terrain]

Random Terrain, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 7:46 PM, said:

Speaking of this kind of thing, I was just given a Seagate GoFlex FreeAgent external hard drive. It came with Memeo Instant Backup and it's backing stuff up right now.

For anyone who wants to know, it took about 24 hours to backup my 291 GB hard drive and I keep checking the external hard drive to make sure and it really is saving my changes and new files a minute or two later. I'll still upload important files once in a while for extra protection, but it's nice to know I probably won't lose my latest files if my main hard drive dies.

[jbs30000]

SpiceWare, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 12:36 PM, said:

jbs30000, on Sat Feb 5, 2011 11:11 AM, said:

I was working on a 2600 Space Harrier game last year. It wasn't half bad, but a few months ago my hard drive crashed and I had no backups, so it's all gone now.

Next time start a blog and upload your source files to it. If you want to keep the project private, then just leave the blog entries in draft mode. Makes for a handy off-site backup, it's what I do.

Thanks, but I'm backing up to a flash drive now. I can save to my on-line Windows Live Office account, but it's easier to just put everything on the flash drive.

[potatohead]

Just don't lose it

[jbs30000]

potatohead, on Mon Feb 7, 2011 11:21 PM, said:

Just don't lose it

Don't worry it's right...Oh crap!



But getting back the topic of this thread; I think I'll wait until this is no longer the beta version before trying to program with this new kernel. For reasons unknown, from time to time I seem to have problems that nobody else has, so if I tried programing with the new kernel I wouldn't know if any errors I got were from errors in the kernel or if it was just me.

But I'm excited by the single height sprites and the multiple sprites with no flicker. We're going to be able to make some pretty awesome games now.

[Random Terrain]

jbs30000, on Tue Feb 8, 2011 1:18 AM, said:

But I'm excited by the single height sprites and the multiple sprites with no flicker. We're going to be able to make some pretty awesome games now.

Yeah, it's amazing how much better a sprite can look if it doesn't have double-height pixels. Now we're really going to have a shot at trying to make Activision/Imagic quality sprites.

I wonder if our new abilities will include Boulder Dash style playfield graphics:

Brainstorming: 2600 Tiled Game Ideas

Edited by Random Terrain, Tue Feb 8, 2011 1:40 AM.

[PAC-MAN-RED]

Philsan, on Tue Feb 1, 2011 3:21 AM, said:

I haven't undertood immediately than now players can have single line resolution.
Not only games must be reprogrammed but also graphics must be redesigned.
PAC-MAN-RED!

OW! Hey! No need to yell! My thread's in the same forum next to this one. So much reading, so little time.

[theloon]

Anyone heard more about how the extra space on melody/harmony boards can be used?

Last time Fred talked about it he was thinking of only using the extra space for playfield and sprite data only. This would definitely limit the possibilities. If the extra EEPROM could be used closer to standard DATA statements I could see story based RPGs and other data centric games finally possible on the 2600.

As a workaround I considered loading a playfield that was actually a block of ones and zeros that could be read into variables. This technique assumes that reading playfield pixel values still works in the new kernel..

Edited by theloon, Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:05 AM.

[abaudrand]

theloon, on Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:03 AM, said:

Anyone heard more about how the extra space on melody/harmony boards can be used?

Last time Fred talked about it he was thinking of only using the extra space for playfield and sprite data only. This would definitely limit the possibilities. If the extra EEPROM could be used closer to standard DATA statements I could see story based RPGs and other data centric games finally possible on the 2600.

As a workaround I considered loading a playfield that was actually a block of ones and zeros that could be read into variables. This technique assumes that reading playfield pixel values still works in the new kernel..

I've asked the same question earlier in the thread and according to Batari, you will only have access to the 256Ko for graphics not for the core of the game. If its 32Ko+256Ko(graphics), I will try to upgrade my current project on it, otherwise, I 'll keep it with the older version as my graphics only weights 3Ko for the moment.

[batari]

abaudrand, on Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:00 PM, said:

theloon, on Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:03 AM, said:

Anyone heard more about how the extra space on melody/harmony boards can be used?

Last time Fred talked about it he was thinking of only using the extra space for playfield and sprite data only. This would definitely limit the possibilities. If the extra EEPROM could be used closer to standard DATA statements I could see story based RPGs and other data centric games finally possible on the 2600.

As a workaround I considered loading a playfield that was actually a block of ones and zeros that could be read into variables. This technique assumes that reading playfield pixel values still works in the new kernel..

I've asked the same question earlier in the thread and according to Batari, you will only have access to the 256Ko for graphics not for the core of the game. If its 32Ko+256Ko(graphics), I will try to upgrade my current project on it, otherwise, I 'll keep it with the older version as my graphics only weights 3Ko for the moment.

Yes, this is mostly true, and it's a DPC+ thing rather than a general Harmony/Melody thing. To use space beyond 32k, you need to copy the data from an external chip into the Harmony/Melody's internal RAM. DPC+ uses all of the internal RAM for graphics, bankswitch code, music frequencies, and general workspace. A simpler bankswitch scheme might have 4k of RAM available so you could swap in an entire bank of code at a time, but you wouldn't get the DPC+ features.

That said, the extra space could be used for data, but it would work best as sdata and not regular, random access data statements.

[yuppicide]

If I start coding a game with this new version, when you do add score some day do you think we might need to change anything else in our code? I don't want to start coding something with XX amount of sprites say only to not have it later.

[RevEng]

Discovered an issue with collision detection. The bug/incomplete-feature list so far...

• collision()s never clear, because the DPC kernel isn't hitting CXCLR up front like the other kernels. (workaround by adding a "CXCLR=1" prior to your drawscreen, or after your collision detections.)
  
• You can't call drawscreen from another bank when using the DPC kernel, due to the DPC setup using a plain jsr. (workaround by creating a drawscreen wrapper function in bank1, and use "gosub drawwrapper bank1" instead of a drawscreen)
  
• player0x=0, ballx=0, etc. all position the objects on the right-hand side of the screen. (workaround... no trivial one. All coordinate comparisons will need to take this into account, and then updated when this bug is fixed.)

Edited by RevEng, Tue Feb 15, 2011 8:27 AM.

[theloon]

@Batari: sdata statements would be awesome! I think this would work for background music data as well.

@RevEng: Thanks for posting gotchas and workarounds! Tempted to get my feet wet again (in bB programming). Definitely helps to know what the beta is capable and not capable of.