23 replies to this topic

[Emehr]

I usually don't bitch and whine about eBay stuff but this particular seller just rubbed me the wrong way. I won the auction yesterday afternoon. The seller sends me a followup email asking if I want an invoice. I respond "no thanks", and pay via PayPal this morning. My PayPal account is tied to my debit card. I don't keep money in my actual PayPal account because I usually don't partake in eBay regularly.

So he gets his money and proceeds to send me an email saying he only received a portion of it because PayPal keeps a percentage if the transaction is made via credit card (although technically it was debit). He wants me to either pay the $9.44 or reject my payment and, I guess, have me put the money in my PayPal account and pay with that. This was a $300+ transaction, not exactly a drop in the bucket for me.

Do I...

a. Tell him "Sorry, not my problem" and risk having my items arrive either broken and/or urinated upon.
b. Pay the $9.44.
c. Have him reject my payment, move the money from my bank to PayPal, and use those funds for payment.
d. Tell him to reject my payment and just relist the item.

He says he won't ship until this is resolved. He's holding my item hostage, I'm out $300+, and he's entering a pissing match over less than 10 bucks. I wasn't aware of that PayPal fee nor do I care. If he was aware of it he should have stated in his initial email or in the item description that he didn't want to pay PayPal's fees. Advice? Thanks in advance!

[Albert]

That's bullshit right there, I would report this jackass to eBay and I most certainly WOULD NOT give him another penny. I'm pretty sure that sellers on eBay have to accept the PayPal fees and it's against eBay's rules for a seller to try and extort additional fees out of a buyer after the auction ends. Does this eBay member have previous selling experience? Can you link his account here?

In addition to reporting him to eBay (along with the copy of the email if the message wasn't sent via eBay's message system) I'd probably tell him to reject your payment. I hope whatever you bought is something you can get from another seller, as I'd also be concerned that this guy would be an ass and not properly package your item when eBay sides with you.

..Al

[rmaerz]

If he doesn't state in the item description then you are not obligated to pick up the tab in my opinion.

I look at it this way: as a seller, the buyer is already picking up the tab on shipping. I never ask for a Paypal gift whether I sell here on AtariAge, GameGavel or eBay. As a buyer, I'm no longer gifting sellers Paypal.

If you pay the additional $9+, I don't think the seller is going to damage or piss on the item(s).

It's possible the seller is trying to be difficult because the item sold for less than expected and could be squeezing whatever additional dough he can. If you don't pay up, he would then happily refund the money and relist the item in hopes of making more money.

I suppose at this point it depends on whether you want the item bad enough or the seller wants to get rid of it bad enough.

[Emehr]

Thanks for the advice, Al. This is him. He's been a member since '02 and has 100% positive feedback (but only 4 transactions). I just sent him an email to reject my payment and thanked him for the heads up (that he's a shady seller). I'll report him as soon as my money is no longer in holding. Fortunately, he's communicating through eBay's system so everything is on record.

It's definitely an item I can get from another seller so I won't be shedding any tears over it. Thanks again, Al!

[Albert]

As a matter of principal, I would not pay the seller the $9+. It's extortion and either the seller doesn't understand that this is simply how PayPal works (and especially when connected to eBay), or he's trying to take advantage of you to get a few more dollars. Either way I'm sure this is against eBay's seller policy, in fact, here are several pages that clearly spell these rules out out:

http://pages.ebay.co...l-payments.html
http://pages.ebay.co...l/policies.html
http://pages.ebay.co...surcharges.html

Quote

Sellers who offer PayPal as a payment option in their eBay listings (either via logos or through text in the item description) must accept card funded payments. Sellers must have a Premier or Business PayPal Account or be willing to upgrade from a Personal PayPal Account to a Premier or Business Account upon receipt of a card funded payment. Sellers may not communicate to buyers that they only accept account balance or bank account funded payments, or will not accept card funded payments.

and

Quote

Examples of actions that are not allowed on eBay

...

Refusing to accept a buyer's PayPal payment using a credit card when the seller included the PayPal logo in the listing. For more info, see the PayPal payments policy.

Charging buyers an additional fee for their use of ordinary forms of payment including acceptance of checks, money orders, electronic transfers or credit cards. For policy and examples, read our payment surcharges policy.

and finally,

Quote

Sellers are not allowed to charge eBay buyers an additional fee for using ordinary forms of payment, including credit cards, electronic transfers, PayPal, ProPay, and Paymate. These costs should be included in the price of the item and should not be charged separately.

I would send the seller the above links.

..Al

[Albert]

I assume this is the item:

eBay Auction -- Item Number: 140523500967

He was probably hoping for more than $315 given the free shipping he offered. As the auction states he takes PayPal (including separately in his item description), he has no grounds whatsoever to ask you for additional monies after the fact (and even if it was listed in the auction that you had to pay the PayPal fees, you would not be obligated to). I'd definitely be leery of completing this transaction, as if these items are not packed well they will surely be damaged in transit.

..Al

[Emehr]

rmaerz, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:52 AM, said:

It's possible the seller is trying to be difficult because the item sold for less than expected and could be squeezing whatever additional dough he can. If you don't pay up, he would then happily refund the money and relist the item in hopes of making more money.

Yeah, maybe he didn't get what he wanted. It was listed with free shipping and he put in the description that it's a $75 value. Still, if he wanted more out of it then he should have put in a reserve. For what it was (a 9-year-old Mac), I thought he got a tidy sum out of it.

[Albert]

Emehr, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 9:04 AM, said:

Yeah, maybe he didn't get what he wanted. It was listed with free shipping and he put in the description that it's a $75 value. Still, if he wanted more out of it then he should have put in a reserve. For what it was (a 9-year-old Mac), I thought he got a tidy sum out of it.

Yeah, you should be able to get those older PowerMacs all day long. The 22" Cinema Displays are over 10 years old and use Apple's proprietary ADC connector, which is a pain in the ass if you want to use the monitor with a modern system. I had one of these displays along with a $100 DVI -> ADC box at one point. They were nice displays at the time, but you can get 20+ inch displays that probably look better for $150 brand new, with VGA, DVI and possibly HDMI connectors. And probably brighter, given the age of the display (depending on how much use it saw).

..Al

[Emehr]

Albert, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 9:02 AM, said:

I assume this is the item:

eBay Auction -- Item Number: 140523500967

He was probably hoping for more than $315 given the free shipping he offered. As the auction states he takes PayPal (including separately in his item description), he has no grounds whatsoever to ask you for additional monies after the fact (and even if it was listed in the auction that you had to pay the PayPal fees, you would not be obligated to). I'd definitely be leery of completing this transaction, as if these items are not packed well they will surely be damaged in transit.

..Al

Yep, that's the item in question. If I got that much for a computer of that age I would be dancing with joy. It just surprises me that he would jeopardize a transaction for less than $10. Thanks for posting the links, Al. I'll send them along to him after my money is safe. I'm still awaiting his reply...

[ls650]

I agree completely that it's "tough nougies". This is why you set a minimum bid. If you think it's going to cost you a lot for packaging, transaction fees, whatever, you take that into account.

As an experienced seller, he should know this.

[Albert]

ls650, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 9:21 AM, said:

As an experienced seller, he should know this.

Given he only has a feedback rating of 4, I don't think he's a terribly experienced seller.

..Al

[Emehr]

Seller just emailed me back and apologized for not understanding the fee system. He said he's going to ship the item. Now I await with nervousness and wonder if I should ask him to use plenty of bubble wrap...

[Albert]

Emehr, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:06 AM, said:

Seller just emailed me back and apologized for not understanding the fee system. He said he's going to ship the item. Now I await with nervousness and wonder if I should ask him to use plenty of bubble wrap...

What did you end up telling the seller? I assume you hadn't given him any of the above links yet? Good luck, hope the pieces don't arrive in Bubbleope!

..Al

[Emehr]

Albert, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:07 AM, said:

Emehr, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:06 AM, said:

Seller just emailed me back and apologized for not understanding the fee system. He said he's going to ship the item. Now I await with nervousness and wonder if I should ask him to use plenty of bubble wrap...

What did you end up telling the seller? I assume you hadn't given him any of the above links yet? Good luck, hope the pieces don't arrive in Bubbleope!

..Al

All I said was "Hi Charles. Yes, please go ahead and reject my PayPal payment. Thanks for the heads up!". I didn't confront him in any way or send him the links you posted. Either he knew I was calling his bluff or he genuinely didn't know about PayPal's fees.

[Christophero Sly]

I would never directly pay for a transaction that large with funds direct from my bank account. If you end up having a problem, it's nice to have the option of just doing a chargeback on your credit card rather than taking your chances with the Paypal/Ebay disupte resolution process.

[Emehr]

Christophero Sly, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:54 AM, said:

I would never directly pay for a transaction that large with funds direct from my bank account. If you end up having a problem, it's nice to have the option of just doing a chargeback on your credit card rather than taking your chances with the Paypal/Ebay disupte resolution process.

Good advice. Thanks for the tip. I'll keep that in mind next time.

[poobah]

Man, I wish I could sell my G4's for that....

[Albert]

poobah, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 4:56 PM, said:

Man, I wish I could sell my G4's for that....

I had several of these up until a few years ago. I traded one away, sold one for about $500 (amazingly), and actually threw one away at one point (it wasn't working properly, logic board problem). I now have a Mac Pro that I'm not using that I need to sell before it loses too much value. I should be able to get $1500 or so for it and it's four years old (Macs do hold their value pretty well compared to PCs). Wonder if anyone here would be interested in it--it's a beast!

..Al

[Emehr]

poobah, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 4:56 PM, said:

Man, I wish I could sell my G4's for that....

Ack! I wish I knew you were selling! I've been searching for a nice PowerMac for a little while now and I think I've been too picky but I wanted one that...

- is either a Dual 1 GHz Quicksilver or a Dual 1.2 GHz MDD G4 (w/FW400, not FW800)
- didn't look like it was abused
- one where the description sounds like the seller knows their ass from a hole in the ground (I actually saw one that had photos from two different Macs and if you didn't know what to look for you'd miss it).
- no stock photos
- no photos of the PowerMac sitting in some plants (seriously)
- I'm hesitant to buy from recyclers, would rather do business with someone who sounds like they owned it personally and know all the quirks
- having the original restore discs is a huge value to me


Anyway, the seller contacted me again with tracking numbers. He also threw in a set of Apple speakers (I think they're the small translucent globe types based on their proprietary connector).

[Albert]

Emehr, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 5:46 PM, said:

- no photos of the PowerMac sitting in some plants (seriously)

LOL

Quote

Anyway, the seller contacted me again with tracking numbers. He also threw in a set of Apple speakers (I think they're the small translucent globe types based on their proprietary connector).

Good luck, hope you receive the system without any drama upon opening the box!

..Al

[Emehr]

Albert, on Tue Mar 22, 2011 5:49 PM, said:

Quote

Anyway, the seller contacted me again with tracking numbers. He also threw in a set of Apple speakers (I think they're the small translucent globe types based on their proprietary connector).

Good luck, hope you receive the system without any drama upon opening the box!

..Al

Thanks! Me too! We'll see. I'm keeping my fingers crossed. He said it'll arrive Thursday...

[BigO]

Sounds like the guy really was just ignorant and is making good on the deal.

I had a guy once who underestimated shipping by about the same amount on an Atari 7800 (thought it would fit in a flat rate box and it didn't, IIRC). He mentioned it in a self-deprecating humorous kind of way but didn't hesitate at all to ship the the item (freight NOT marked up). When I received the item, I paypal'ed him the shipping deficiency. Given the pittance I paid for the 7800, I had no problem doing that. But, for an item that sold for hundreds, I'm not sure whether I would do the same.

[Emehr]

Turns out this was indeed a case of an inexperienced seller. The Mac and monitor arrived (both in their original boxes) along with everything he described (including original install disks!). Everything is kinda dirty (Apple's translucent plastics somehow suck dust and crap into their innards) but in very nice to excellent shape otherwise. He definitely made good on the deal.

[Albert]

Awesome, glad to hear they arrived in good condition!

..Al