26 replies to this topic

[nopaybob]

So I finally get my package after the estimated ebay date, no biggie, Today open it up and the top plastic storage case for my new atari is busted. There was just a few crumpled sheet of paper not near enough to fill the void in the box, no bubble wrap at all. The box itself did not appear to be damaged. soab
So I contact the seller. Here is a copy of our communication...

Sent by me
The package arrived today, Just one problem, when I opened the box I found the storage case lid is busted.

response from seller
It was fine when I packaged it, and it clearly is not damaged in the picture. It must have gotten broken during shipping. I don't know if the post office will help you out or not since you didn't insure it. Its worth a try for you to go to your local post office and try to put a claim in for it.

Sent by me
I was offended by your statement " I don't know if the post office will help you out or not since you didn't insure it."

I have no intentions of arguing or being rude.

There was not an option to add or pay for insurance when I made payment.
Proper packing and insuring is your job.

Honestly a partial refund would be satisfactory.





What should I do now? I'm just waiting for a response or something , I'd be happy with a refund of 5 bucks....

[SoundGammon]

...I would have told him: "Well, there's still feedback that I must leave for you. it won't be good, just like your packaging!"

[horseboy]

Regardless of what anyone says the responsibility of all things shipping is on the seller and only the seller. As it should be. The seller is responsible for getting any item as listed and as pictured into your possession unharmed. Shippers file claims with USPS and UPS, not the receiving party. File a claim with Ebay. If you are willing to take a partial refund then request a partial refund. If you don't want to do that or he doesn't want to settle then just proceed with the claim. You will win. Ebay will provide you with a shipping label to ship it back and refund you the entire amount including original shipping.


I have had to file many many claims on ebay for stupid shipping. It is amazing the sheer number of idiotic shippers there are out there. One I remember fondly is the time I got a really nice NES action with a really nice box shipped to me with the brown paper treatment. My heart sunk when I saw it.

Edited by horseboy, Wed Jun 8, 2011 3:34 PM.

[bennybingo]

I got a box last week of Atari items and when it arrived, the box consisted of more packing tape than cardboard...seriously. it looked like 3 pieces of cardboard which were precariously held together by a terrible tape job. Almost half the items were either broken or stuck (cart labels and manuals) to the tape. Claim is pending...I took lots of pictures for the folks at the dispute center.

Put in a claim...you should get a refund.

[nopaybob]

I have purchased many things from ebay and most were packed great I've had a few more than I want of poor packaging even a few wrapped and shipped in the brown paper.
I've never made a claim and would just brush this off as a loss like I have before but the sellers response just pissed me off..

I figure I'll wait 24hrs since his last response And then just file with ebay.

[nopaybob]

bennybingo, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 4:02 PM, said:

I got a box last week of Atari items and when it arrived, the box consisted of more packing tape than cardboard...seriously. it looked like 3 pieces of cardboard which were precariously held together by a terrible tape job. Almost half the items were either broken or stuck (cart labels and manuals) to the tape. Claim is pending...I took lots of pictures for the folks at the dispute center.

Put in a claim...you should get a refund.

Thats terrible kinda sounds like a package from Venezuela!

[nopaybob]

Update... 2 new responses from the seller

Response from seller
Sorry, I didn't mean to offend you. I just meant that when someone wants to insure thier item against shipping damages they contact me and have me add it when I ship it out. As far as the packaging goes, I ship items out every day and do my very best to insure quality delivery, I have no control of how the package is handled after it leaves my possesion. That is where insurance comes in handy.

Response from seller
Would a $10.00 refund be satisfactory for you?

Sent from me
That would be acceptable, Thank you

[atarigal]

I'm glad you were able to get the matter resolved. Sellers REALLY REALLY need to learn that INSURANCE IS FOR THE SELLER and that they should purchase it for anything they don't want to lose $$ on. I generally take it out on anything that sells for more than $40.

[AtariLeaf]

Buyer:

Quote

There was just a few crumpled sheet of paper not near enough to fill the void in the box, no bubble wrap at all.

Seller:

Quote

I ship items out every day and do my very best to insure quality delivery, I have no control of how the package is handled after it leaves my possesion.

Sounds like the seller is either in denial, stupid, or both.

[bennybingo]

atarigal, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 4:39 PM, said:

I'm glad you were able to get the matter resolved. Sellers REALLY REALLY need to learn that INSURANCE IS FOR THE SELLER and that they should purchase it for anything they don't want to lose $ on. I generally take it out on anything that sells for more than $40.

Agreed...but I insure more for complete loss of package...not damage. I package everything as "bomb proof" as possible...no matter the value. My biggest concern is loss.

Fragile items like that require extra special care when shipping. I think it is clear that the "extra" part was forgotten...so was the "special" and the "care". I doubt the post office would even have paid a claim on something like that. The first thing USPS looks at is the pack job:

If ii contains fragile contents, and not marked as such - claim denied.
If the tape is substandard - claim denied.
If the interior padding is insufficient - claim denied.
and so on...

Glad you got what you wanted without the painful claims process. Sounds like it was at least less of a loss for you.

[wood_jl]

bennybingo, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 5:07 PM, said:

Agreed...but I insure more for complete loss of package...not damage. I package everything as "bomb proof" as possible...no matter the value. My biggest concern is loss.

Fragile items like that require extra special care when shipping. I think it is clear that the "extra" part was forgotten...so was the "special" and the "care". I doubt the post office would even have paid a claim on something like that. The first thing USPS looks at is the pack job:

If ii contains fragile contents, and not marked as such - claim denied.
If the tape is substandard - claim denied.
If the interior padding is insufficient - claim denied.
and so on...

I thought the insurance was ONLY good for total loss of the package????? I don't see how they could adjudicate what constitutes "good" packing from "bad;" they'd have to set up an entire small claims court to decide those. Most cases, the damage is from a brain-dead MORON doing a a representative (of their pea brain) job of packing. Who is to decide what is substandard and what is sufficient? It wouldn't behoove the Post Office to decide that a broken package was properly packaged and the fault was their handling, so they probably blame it on the packaging most of the time, and they're probably right if they do.

Edited by wood_jl, Wed Jun 8, 2011 8:56 PM.

[anakedg]

In reply to the post above me, you've never seen the episode of Seinfeld where Kramer breaks and then ships Jerry's stereo just cause he didn't like it anymore? Then they get the money back? As I understand it postal insurance via USPS actually works like that and is more of a "no-fault" insurance program sort of like workman's compensation.

[bennybingo]

wood_jl, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 8:55 PM, said:

bennybingo, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 5:07 PM, said:

Agreed...but I insure more for complete loss of package...not damage. I package everything as "bomb proof" as possible...no matter the value. My biggest concern is loss.

Fragile items like that require extra special care when shipping. I think it is clear that the "extra" part was forgotten...so was the "special" and the "care". I doubt the post office would even have paid a claim on something like that. The first thing USPS looks at is the pack job:

If ii contains fragile contents, and not marked as such - claim denied.
If the tape is substandard - claim denied.
If the interior padding is insufficient - claim denied.
and so on...

I thought the insurance was ONLY good for total loss of the package????? I don't see how they could adjudicate what constitutes "good" packing from "bad;" they'd have to set up an entire small claims court to decide those. Most cases, the damage is from a brain-dead MORON doing a a representative (of their pea brain) job of packing. Who is to decide what is substandard and what is sufficient? It wouldn't behoove the Post Office to decide that a broken package was properly packaged and the fault was their handling, so they probably blame it on the packaging most of the time, and they're probably right if they do.

nope:

From the USPS website -

Protection in Transit

Insured Mail - If you’re sending valuable merchandise through the mail, you’ll want to protect it against loss, damage or theft. You can add insurance to cover your mailing up to $5,000 in person or online through Click-N-Ship. Also available at Automated Postal Centers (APCs) and eBay up to $500.

[kheffington]

wood_jl, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 8:55 PM, said:

I thought the insurance was ONLY good for total loss of the package????? I don't see how they could adjudicate what constitutes "good" packing from "bad;" they'd have to set up an entire small claims court to decide those. Most cases, the damage is from a brain-dead MORON doing a a representative (of their pea brain) job of packing. Who is to decide what is substandard and what is sufficient? It wouldn't behoove the Post Office to decide that a broken package was properly packaged and the fault was their handling, so they probably blame it on the packaging most of the time, and they're probably right if they do.

Postal insurance like most other carrier's insurance covers loss of the package or damage to the package. If you have a damaged package, the person receiving the package has to take it to the post office with all the packaging for examination. The post office itself will decide whether or not the packaging was sufficient to ship the item. If they decide it was packaged appropriately a claim can be filed and the insurance recovered. If the post office decides that the packaging was insufficient, you get nothing. The amount paid out on insurance from the Post Office requires proof of amount paid for the item and that is all they will pay even if it is insured for more. The postage paid does not count in the total and is not recoverable. It can take 2-3 months receive a payment of insurance.

As for the small claims court, none is needed. The Post Office is a branch of the Federal Government and can not be sued in a state court. You could at great expense file a Federal Claim of Damage and if that failed ask permission to sue in Federal Court (good luck with that though).

Edited by kheffington, Wed Jun 8, 2011 10:08 PM.

[atarigal]

Yes, if the damage was due to USPS handling (as the seller in this instance claimed--obviously falsely), then insurance would pay the $$ back. I just hate when sellers use the "you didn't ask for/pay insurance" excuse... it's not the buyer's responsibility to take out the insurance but the seller's.

[akator]

kheffington, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 9:42 PM, said:

The postage paid does not count in the total and is not recoverable.

It's an Illuminati conspiracy, I tell you. A conspiracy!

[Tickled_Pink]

AtariLeaf, on Wed Jun 8, 2011 4:47 PM, said:

Buyer:

Quote

There was just a few crumpled sheet of paper not near enough to fill the void in the box, no bubble wrap at all.

Seller:

Quote

I ship items out every day and do my very best to insure quality delivery, I have no control of how the package is handled after it leaves my possesion.

Sounds like the seller is either in denial, stupid, or both.

Or just been very lucky up till now.

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

In contrast just like to add just about everything I have bought from members here on atariage have been extremely well packaged, some might say overly so when I open my items and all are individually packed in bubble wrap, taped tightly surrounded by foam peanuts etc. I laughed in a couple of my unboxing videos just because it was taking me so long to unwrap and get to the items but I have learned to have my X-Acto knife and everything prepared before hand before starting my video lol. That is not a complaint that's for sure, as I unwrap every piece of the package I cannot help but think "This person gives a damn!" and I know everything was packaged with loving care and attention to detail to ensure a fellow collector receives a treasured item. so many who sell on Ebay could care less and are just trying to cash in on the surge of popularity of retro gaming and computing and that's fine, I understand it but when I see an Atari 2600 lot and clearly they could not take 2 seconds to at least wipe off the surface dust and grime to take the damn picture it pisses me off, you want my $$$ and your asking for top dollar but you cannot bother to even attempt to make it look presentable and then you ship it in the worse possible way?

[Yurkie]

You should have told them, that since they did such a shitty job packing that insurance wouldn't have done you any good!

The Post Office will not honor insurance if packing is not sufficient to offer reasonable protection while in transit, which they clearly did not do.

I have got my share of items pretty much thrown in a box loose to bang around and get destroyed. Should be a rule...if your a F&@king idiot that can't pack items safely, then you can't sell on Ebay.

One of the things that really irritates me is putting a CIB game in a padded envelope, so it can get smashed so badly that the box is not even worth having. I always send a question and ask it game box will be shipped inside a box and not an envelope to protect it in transit and even offer extra shipping money if needed. I would rather throw them an extra $5 bill and pay way to much for shipping than have the box get destroyed.

Edited by Yurkie, Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:53 AM.

[Mendon]

The last thing I bought from eBay was a power supply for a Xbox360 I had been given. The seller shipped the power supply to me in a priority mail ENVELOPE....

Though the envelope was pretty beat up when the postman dropped it off, I got lucky as the power supply appeared to survive and worked.



Mendon

[the-topdog]

It sounds to me like the seller was a reasonable guy. After the OP voiced his disappointment, the seller offered the partial refund. I see no harm, no foul here so long as the seller takes responsibility like that.

[Tempest]

I had someone once send me one of those old big long PC sound cards (might have been an AWE32 or Ad Lib) in a small padded envelope. I don't know how the hell it survived, but it got to me in one piece even though the envelope was shredded. I think sometimes the sellers just don't think before they send stuff out.

Tempest

[AtariLeaf]

Tempest, on Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:32 AM, said:

I had someone once send me one of those old big long PC sound cards (might have been an AWE32 or Ad Lib) in a small padded envelope. I don't know how the hell it survived, but it got to me in one piece even though the envelope was shredded. I think sometimes the sellers just don't think before they send stuff out.

Tempest

Thinking requires ownership of a brain, which I don't think is the case with most of these idiots.

[nopaybob]

So it happens again today, nothing broke just slightly damaged from poor packing!
Here are a couple of pics

Nice and trashy
Boxed games directly on the bottom of box and used trash to fill, Yay!



Now my boxed Atari 2600 which came with new custom smushed corners, SOAB



I have yet to leave a neg ever on ebay but, Seller beware the next crappy package is going to get a neg.

[flashjazzcat]

I wasn't sure where to post this but a topic on poorly damaged goods seemed as good a place as any.

I bought a Commodore 1084S-D1, BIN 10GBP on Wednesday this week. The monitor was badly yellowed, described as in "fair" condition (which seemed entirely accurate), but tested and working. The picture showed the monitor with a stable picture from an Amiga 600. Shipping - as is always the case with this particular seller (from whom I have bought once in the past, but I follow his auctions regularly) was a hefty 16 GBP, but this was for a ParcelForce service which is apparently the only one to insure CRT monitors (up to a value of 30 GBP, and this was clearly stated in the listing as being the reason for choosing this more expensive courier).

Anyway, the monitor arrived on Friday morning in a double-walled carton but with a corner of the fascia smashed in, and the drop-down front flap snapped in two. Reinspection of the packaging revealed that - although double-walled - the carton contained very little shock-absorbing material (basically I'm used to receiving CRT monitors wrapped in about 20 ft of jumbo bubble-wrap). The inner carton was just padded out with lumps of carboard and paper, and the monitor itself was wrapped in a double layer of thin bubble-wrap.

I photographed the damage, then tested the monitor and found that the vertical hold was gone. Possibly fixable, but then he's not to know I like poking around in the back of CRT monitors. I sent the seller a detailed report of the damage, along with photos and a video of the rolling picture.

Very late on Friday evening he replied saying that ParcelForce use agency staff at Christmas and monitors "do tend to get thrown about a bit", and that he'd had problems claiming on the insurance in the past. I replied by asking why he used ParcelForce on the basis that they're insured if the insurance policy is actually difficult to claim on. This morning he replied by complaining that dishonest buyers have spoiled it for honest ones by making false reports of damaged items, etc, that claiming from ParcelForce involves filling in lots of forms, and that of a batch of monitors he's sold, one other has so far arrived safely.

Sounds like a lot of guff to me, but I've hinted that I'll be completely satisfied with a partial refund so hopefully he'll at least refund me the cost of the item. I may have been a little spoiled by the last seller from whom I bought a CRT: it arrived superbly packaged (single-wall carton, tons of bubble-wrap), but had a couple of (fixable) faults which the seller had failed to mention in the listing. He admitted he'd listed the item in haste and hadn't fully tested it, and refunded the price of the item. I left him glowing feedback, and he I.