I've got several boxed 7800 games and no 7800 console! I've also got a 5200 and 800XL on the way, but they may or may not be working (fingers crossed). Is there a big difference among these systems as far as the classic arcade ports go (Pac-Man, Defender, Dig Dug)? Given that I would use the same controller on all three systems, which one offers the best gameplay for these types of games?
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Differences between 7800, 5200, 8-bit arcade ports?
Started by boxpressed, Aug 7 2011 10:27 PM
39 replies to this topic
#2 OFFLINE
BassGuitari
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Posted Mon Aug 8, 2011 12:31 AM
The Atari 5200 requires an Atari 5200 controller. 2600/7800/8-bit joysticks won't help you with a 5200.
Atari 5200 and 400/800 ports are more or less identical, apart from the controller action (5200's analog vs. 400/800's digital). Some 400/800 games that were ported to the 5200 do have some minor changes -Space Invaders comes to mind- but gameplay is the same.
As far as which console "offers the best gameplay," it's a wash. It also depends on the game. I like 5200 Choplifter more than 7800 Choplifter, but I like 7800 Ms. Pac-Man more than 5200 Ms. Pac-Man. The Atari 5200 tends to be less popular on the grounds that getting working controllers is a pain in the neck, but the games themselves are generally high-quality arcade ports. The 7800 also has some great arcade ports, and they're different enough to warrant playing. Note that the Atari 7800 never got ports of Defender or Pac-Man* back in the day.
*See the Pac-Man Collection 7800 homebrew. It pretty much trumps all previous Atari versions of Pac-Man and Ms. Pac-Man, and I believe it includes other Pac games, too.
Atari 5200 and 400/800 ports are more or less identical, apart from the controller action (5200's analog vs. 400/800's digital). Some 400/800 games that were ported to the 5200 do have some minor changes -Space Invaders comes to mind- but gameplay is the same.
As far as which console "offers the best gameplay," it's a wash. It also depends on the game. I like 5200 Choplifter more than 7800 Choplifter, but I like 7800 Ms. Pac-Man more than 5200 Ms. Pac-Man. The Atari 5200 tends to be less popular on the grounds that getting working controllers is a pain in the neck, but the games themselves are generally high-quality arcade ports. The 7800 also has some great arcade ports, and they're different enough to warrant playing. Note that the Atari 7800 never got ports of Defender or Pac-Man* back in the day.
*See the Pac-Man Collection 7800 homebrew. It pretty much trumps all previous Atari versions of Pac-Man and Ms. Pac-Man, and I believe it includes other Pac games, too.
#3 OFFLINE
toptenmaterial
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Posted Mon Aug 8, 2011 10:44 AM
Sort of in line with what B.G. wrote, both the 5200 and 7800 have some excellent games. A few things to keep in mind about the 5200: untested controllers are dead 99.9% of the time, the analog doesn't self-center (and is terrible for arcade conversions), and other controllers aren't compatible without pricey adapters. The 5200 is awesome but you must sink some cash into it to get the control options that you want.
The plus side is that the games are absolutely gorgeous, with bright, vivid graphics and sound quality that eclipses the 2600/7800.
I just got a 5200 myself from a fellow AA'er with rebuilt controls. They still suck. There is a guy on the AA marketplace selling his own Master Play adapter, which allows you to use an SMS and Genesis controller for the 5200. If you enjoyed using that set-up on your 2600 then you might like that.
The plus side is that the games are absolutely gorgeous, with bright, vivid graphics and sound quality that eclipses the 2600/7800.
I just got a 5200 myself from a fellow AA'er with rebuilt controls. They still suck. There is a guy on the AA marketplace selling his own Master Play adapter, which allows you to use an SMS and Genesis controller for the 5200. If you enjoyed using that set-up on your 2600 then you might like that.
#4 OFFLINE
boxpressed
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Posted Mon Aug 8, 2011 12:47 PM
Thanks for the advice. Don't know how I forgot that the 5200 has its own analog controls. I'm pretty sure that the ones I'll be getting will be flaky. Because there's so much overlap for these three platforms, I may concentrate on CIB exclusives for each platform. I'm right of out the gate here for collecting for these platforms, so I want to be sure that I have a good plan.
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Posted Mon Aug 8, 2011 2:33 PM
BassGuitari, on Mon Aug 8, 2011 12:31 AM, said:
The Atari 5200 tends to be less popular on the grounds that getting working controllers is a pain in the neck, but the games themselves are generally high-quality arcade ports.
Yeah, though 5200 owners tend to be the most fiercely loyal.
#6 OFFLINE
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Posted Mon Aug 8, 2011 5:50 PM
DracIsBack, on Mon Aug 8, 2011 2:33 PM, said:
BassGuitari, on Mon Aug 8, 2011 12:31 AM, said:
The Atari 5200 tends to be less popular on the grounds that getting working controllers is a pain in the neck, but the games themselves are generally high-quality arcade ports.
Yeah, though 5200 owners tend to be the most fiercely loyal.
Yes, we do.
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Posted Mon Aug 8, 2011 6:52 PM
How hard is it to get a 5200 on a modern tv? Aren't the power supplies tied to the rf box?
#8 OFFLINE
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Posted Mon Aug 8, 2011 11:51 PM
gorfcadet, on Mon Aug 8, 2011 6:52 PM, said:
How hard is it to get a 5200 on a modern tv? Aren't the power supplies tied to the rf box?
With four-port systems, yes. Two-port systems have a power supply connection on the console and use a standard switchbox, just like any other console*.
And it isn't hard to connect an Atari 5200 to a modern television. You may need a couple of small and inexpensive adapters, depending on which model you have, but it can be done easily. The 4-port's much-maligned automatic switchbox is actually a piece of cake to connect: hook your antenna cable to the switchbox, and hook the switchbox into your television/vcr/dvd antenna input. It's already cable-ready. To connect a 2-port 5200, you'll need either a Phono-to-Coax adapter or some 75-ohm transformers for your old switchbox. There are directions for hooking this stuff up all over the internet, including right here at AtariAge. I personally think these old games look better on a CRT television set, but there is something majestic about an Atari (or whatever) game being spread across the 42 inches of my HDTV.
(*Except the RCA Studio II, which is the only other system I know of whose power supply connects to a proprietary switchbox.)
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Posted Tue Aug 9, 2011 3:56 AM
Thanks for the info! The 5200 was the only Atari I never owned. I always wanted one, but my folks decided that year to get a Commodore 64. It was educational after all.
#10 OFFLINE
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Posted Tue Aug 9, 2011 8:37 AM
gorfcadet, on Tue Aug 9, 2011 3:56 AM, said:
Thanks for the info! The 5200 was the only Atari I never owned. I always wanted one, but my folks decided that year to get a Commodore 64. It was educational after all.
Yes, I'm really intrigued by the 5200 now, much moreso than by the 7800, which seems to lack the "personality" of the 5200. Growing up, I had a love/hate with the 5200 since I owned a Colecovision. I loved the CV but felt winces of pain when I would see screenshots of cool games on the 5200.
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Posted Tue Aug 9, 2011 8:33 PM
boxpressed, on Tue Aug 9, 2011 8:37 AM, said:
Growing up, I had a love/hate with the 5200 since I owned a Colecovision. I loved the CV but felt winces of pain when I would see screenshots of cool games on the 5200.
5200 and Colecovision are really the perfect complementary systems for 80's arcade goodness. Games that one system does not have, the other one offers.
My suggestion is to have them hooked up side by side on the entertainment center.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:33 AM
My CV controller's fire buttons are just shot. Every time I play, I have to start game with player 2 and use a sega/atari pad to play, but damn fine game of Donkey Kong and Zaxxon.
#13 OFFLINE
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:34 PM
I love both 5200 and 7800; the 5200 has excellent ports of Moon Patrol, Qix, Space Dungeon and Popeye. The controllers are an issue, but I spent the current price of $43 to get a Best Electronics Lifetime Gold upgraded controller, and really enjoy it for most games. I also have particular love for the 5200's version of Pac-Man and Space Invaders.
The 7800 has completely awesome versions of Food Fight, Dig Dug, Ms. Pac-Man, Robotron 2084, Joust and several others. There are lots of great homebrew 7800 games that are arcade ports, like Pac-Man Collection, Space Duel, Burger Time, Q*Bert and more.
While you likely can't use one controller on all three systems you mention, it's worth having both at the ready I would say.
The 7800 has completely awesome versions of Food Fight, Dig Dug, Ms. Pac-Man, Robotron 2084, Joust and several others. There are lots of great homebrew 7800 games that are arcade ports, like Pac-Man Collection, Space Duel, Burger Time, Q*Bert and more.
While you likely can't use one controller on all three systems you mention, it's worth having both at the ready I would say.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:12 PM
I think in general the 7800 graphics are superior, but the sound is far inferior.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:38 PM
This thread makes me want to shoot myself in the face. To equate the 5200 to the 7800 as "a wash" is insanity. I'm not gonna knock the 5200, it has some wonderful games that I enjoy and it was a beast of a system and I'm proud to own a vsx. That said it was a bumbling oaf of a game machine and to this day I feel as if I'm about to electrocute myself every time I plug it in turn it on and watch that effer spark.
I agree with Curious Sofa in that the 5200 has some excellent ports of games like Moon Patrol, etc. that's one of the greatest reasons to own the 5200. Another is how well it does Atari classics like Super Breakout and Pac-Man. And then there are other games like Jungle Hunt and Kangaroo that leave me scratching my head and asking if these are really that much greater than their 2600 counterparts.
There's something about the 5200 that feels very limited, as if Atari had the ability to make the 5200 a powerful machine that could have lasted through the rest of the decade and competed with the NES and SMS, and yet you're left with the feeling that Atari lacked the foresight to make that happen, rushed it to market and capped the 5200 as being a limited machine, very grounded at home in its generation right along with Intellivision and Colecovision. And even within the environment of its own generation it was very limited, Intellivision and Colecovision were playing 2600 games before the 5200 was, and in ways that were sleeker, more reliable and offered better controllers. The whole thing reminds me of Sega Saturn with the 7800 as the Dreamcast swansong.
Go play Pole Position on 5200 and then on 7800 and come back to me and let's see what you have to say. The 7800 lacks ANTIC and POKEY but to pretend that the 7800 isn't a clear step forward into another generation in gaming is simply untrue, and to assert that the 7800 lacks personality is asinine. Ninja Golf anybody? Midnight Mutants? Alien Brigade? Food Fight? Yeah that's not personality. Especially compared to the 5200 which mostly rehashed A8 & 2600 games that everybody already had. Good thing these game systems are 30 years old and we now have the ability to economically purchase both systems and enjoy the hell out of each of them for what they really are.
I agree with Curious Sofa in that the 5200 has some excellent ports of games like Moon Patrol, etc. that's one of the greatest reasons to own the 5200. Another is how well it does Atari classics like Super Breakout and Pac-Man. And then there are other games like Jungle Hunt and Kangaroo that leave me scratching my head and asking if these are really that much greater than their 2600 counterparts.
There's something about the 5200 that feels very limited, as if Atari had the ability to make the 5200 a powerful machine that could have lasted through the rest of the decade and competed with the NES and SMS, and yet you're left with the feeling that Atari lacked the foresight to make that happen, rushed it to market and capped the 5200 as being a limited machine, very grounded at home in its generation right along with Intellivision and Colecovision. And even within the environment of its own generation it was very limited, Intellivision and Colecovision were playing 2600 games before the 5200 was, and in ways that were sleeker, more reliable and offered better controllers. The whole thing reminds me of Sega Saturn with the 7800 as the Dreamcast swansong.
Go play Pole Position on 5200 and then on 7800 and come back to me and let's see what you have to say. The 7800 lacks ANTIC and POKEY but to pretend that the 7800 isn't a clear step forward into another generation in gaming is simply untrue, and to assert that the 7800 lacks personality is asinine. Ninja Golf anybody? Midnight Mutants? Alien Brigade? Food Fight? Yeah that's not personality. Especially compared to the 5200 which mostly rehashed A8 & 2600 games that everybody already had. Good thing these game systems are 30 years old and we now have the ability to economically purchase both systems and enjoy the hell out of each of them for what they really are.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:29 PM
Atari Joe, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:38 PM, said:
This thread makes me want to shoot myself in the face. To equate the 5200 to the 7800 as "a wash" is insanity. I'm not gonna knock the 5200, it has some wonderful games that I enjoy and it was a beast of a system and I'm proud to own a vsx. That said it was a bumbling oaf of a game machine and to this day I feel as if I'm about to electrocute myself every time I plug it in turn it on and watch that effer spark.
I agree with Curious Sofa in that the 5200 has some excellent ports of games like Moon Patrol, etc. that's one of the greatest reasons to own the 5200. Another is how well it does Atari classics like Super Breakout and Pac-Man. And then there are other games like Jungle Hunt and Kangaroo that leave me scratching my head and asking if these are really that much greater than their 2600 counterparts.
There's something about the 5200 that feels very limited, as if Atari had the ability to make the 5200 a powerful machine that could have lasted through the rest of the decade and competed with the NES and SMS, and yet you're left with the feeling that Atari lacked the foresight to make that happen, rushed it to market and capped the 5200 as being a limited machine, very grounded at home in its generation right along with Intellivision and Colecovision. And even within the environment of its own generation it was very limited, Intellivision and Colecovision were playing 2600 games before the 5200 was, and in ways that were sleeker, more reliable and offered better controllers. The whole thing reminds me of Sega Saturn with the 7800 as the Dreamcast swansong.
Go play Pole Position on 5200 and then on 7800 and come back to me and let's see what you have to say. The 7800 lacks ANTIC and POKEY but to pretend that the 7800 isn't a clear step forward into another generation in gaming is simply untrue, and to assert that the 7800 lacks personality is asinine. Ninja Golf anybody? Midnight Mutants? Alien Brigade? Food Fight? Yeah that's not personality. Especially compared to the 5200 which mostly rehashed A8 & 2600 games that everybody already had. Good thing these game systems are 30 years old and we now have the ability to economically purchase both systems and enjoy the hell out of each of them for what they really are.
I agree with Curious Sofa in that the 5200 has some excellent ports of games like Moon Patrol, etc. that's one of the greatest reasons to own the 5200. Another is how well it does Atari classics like Super Breakout and Pac-Man. And then there are other games like Jungle Hunt and Kangaroo that leave me scratching my head and asking if these are really that much greater than their 2600 counterparts.
There's something about the 5200 that feels very limited, as if Atari had the ability to make the 5200 a powerful machine that could have lasted through the rest of the decade and competed with the NES and SMS, and yet you're left with the feeling that Atari lacked the foresight to make that happen, rushed it to market and capped the 5200 as being a limited machine, very grounded at home in its generation right along with Intellivision and Colecovision. And even within the environment of its own generation it was very limited, Intellivision and Colecovision were playing 2600 games before the 5200 was, and in ways that were sleeker, more reliable and offered better controllers. The whole thing reminds me of Sega Saturn with the 7800 as the Dreamcast swansong.
Go play Pole Position on 5200 and then on 7800 and come back to me and let's see what you have to say. The 7800 lacks ANTIC and POKEY but to pretend that the 7800 isn't a clear step forward into another generation in gaming is simply untrue, and to assert that the 7800 lacks personality is asinine. Ninja Golf anybody? Midnight Mutants? Alien Brigade? Food Fight? Yeah that's not personality. Especially compared to the 5200 which mostly rehashed A8 & 2600 games that everybody already had. Good thing these game systems are 30 years old and we now have the ability to economically purchase both systems and enjoy the hell out of each of them for what they really are.
Okay, I'm convinced. Just picked up a CIB 7800 off eBay to go with the 7800 games I already have. Plus, I'm looking forward to playing all those 2600 carts that don't fit in my H6.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:29 PM
boxpressed, on Tue Aug 9, 2011 8:37 AM, said:
gorfcadet, on Tue Aug 9, 2011 3:56 AM, said:
Thanks for the info! The 5200 was the only Atari I never owned. I always wanted one, but my folks decided that year to get a Commodore 64. It was educational after all.
Yes, I'm really intrigued by the 5200 now, much moreso than by the 7800, which seems to lack the "personality" of the 5200.
They both have their own (personality), but the 5200 overall is a much more fun machine. Many of the games available for both systems are virtually identical which is surprising. Ballblazer, Ms Pacman, Centipede, Robotron....really, not much difference and in the case of Centipede and Robotron the 5200 version blows away the 7800 version with the advanced control of the trackball and the joystick coupler (respectively). The 7800 arcade games are really good like Galaga, Asteroids, Food Fight, etc...pretty much the non-arcade games are especially dry or to difficult to enjoy. That's not to say it's not a system worth owning. Get both, but if you have to choose one over the other go with the big black beauty. You'll enjoy it much, much more.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:36 PM
jetset, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:29 PM, said:
in the case of Centipede and Robotron the 5200 version blows away the 7800 version with the advanced control of the trackball and the joystick coupler (respectively).
What's the difference with Robotron? I don't have a (usable) 5200, but I play Robotron with two sticks all the time on my 7800 and it's awesome.
#19 OFFLINE
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:37 PM
jetset, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:29 PM, said:
not much difference and in the case of Centipede and Robotron the 5200 version blows away the 7800 version with the advanced control of the trackball and the joystick coupler (respectively).
kenfused did a hack of 7800 Centipede to make it trackball compatible here :-
http://www.atariage....post__p__880479
I'm sure if you ask Albert he'll put it on cart (check out the custom cart in the AA store).
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:10 PM
Rex Dart, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:36 PM, said:
jetset, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:29 PM, said:
in the case of Centipede and Robotron the 5200 version blows away the 7800 version with the advanced control of the trackball and the joystick coupler (respectively).
What's the difference with Robotron? I don't have a (usable) 5200, but I play Robotron with two sticks all the time on my 7800 and it's awesome.
The 5200 has a coupler that holds the sticks in place so it's just like the arcade. The 7800 is good if you happen to have the kind of controller that has suction cups on the bottoms and a flat surface. Even then though eventually the suction comes loose if/when the game gets intense.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:17 PM
jetset, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:10 PM, said:
The 5200 has a coupler that holds the sticks in place so it's just like the arcade. The 7800 is good if you happen to have the kind of controller that has suction cups on the bottoms and a flat surface. Even then though eventually the suction comes loose if/when the game gets intense.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:17 PM
jetset, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:10 PM, said:
Rex Dart, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:36 PM, said:
jetset, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:29 PM, said:
in the case of Centipede and Robotron the 5200 version blows away the 7800 version with the advanced control of the trackball and the joystick coupler (respectively).
What's the difference with Robotron? I don't have a (usable) 5200, but I play Robotron with two sticks all the time on my 7800 and it's awesome.
The 5200 has a coupler that holds the sticks in place so it's just like the arcade. The 7800 is good if you happen to have the kind of controller that has suction cups on the bottoms and a flat surface. Even then though eventually the suction comes loose if/when the game gets intense.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:20 PM
jetset, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:10 PM, said:
The 5200 has a coupler that holds the sticks in place so it's just like the arcade. The 7800 is good if you happen to have the kind of controller that has suction cups on the bottoms and a flat surface. Even then though eventually the suction comes loose if/when the game gets intense.
Oh. The 7800 is compatible with controllers that don't suck, so I haven't needed a coupler.
Do you mean the region in the back of the 5200, or some extra product?
Edited by Rex Dart, Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:21 PM.
#24 OFFLINE
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:21 PM
the 2600 controllers had a two stick solution with the A8 didn't it? Id use those on the 78 if I wasn't already using my Sega 6 button pads to play Robotron. i'm pretty sure I could set the high on it if I could just control my urge to die after about 45 minutes. That is the first version of Robotron that I think I could play perpetually gaining more men than I lose.
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Posted Wed Aug 10, 2011 8:21 PM
Atari Joe, on Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:38 PM, said:
This thread makes me want to shoot myself in the face. To equate the 5200 to the 7800 as "a wash" is insanity.
That's a little rude, isn't it?
The OP was asking whether the 5200's or 7800's games offer the "best" gameplay. I said it's a wash, that both systems have great games with great gameplay. You yourself agree that they both have good games. So what's the problem?
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