23 replies to this topic

[Robert Carrion]

I got my Atari 7800 today and I have a few questions. First thing, go easy on me, I'm 28, my first system was an NES at 5 years old for Christmas. I remember how things work with systems I had over the years. Atari 7800 and any Atari previous I never owned, so I don't remember or know what should and shouldn't happen with a system. No doubt, if I grew up with an Atari 7800 I probably would know the answers to many of these questions already, just like I know what to expect with NES problems from memory. But I didn't grow up with it, so I can't tell what is perhaps problems due to age or just the way the units are. Even a new NES could be a picky. So thats why I am asking here to people who probably know alot about what is what with an Atari 7800, etc.

Ok questions:

1) Is the power button normally finicky or is that just my used unit I bought online, being a little broken down over the years. Times when I hit the power button and it doesn't shut off, other times it does. Basically I usually just keep trying to it works or doesn't work. Although it seems pushing it down hard to start and hard again to stop works most of the time. My other question in connection with that, if it is not normal, is it possible the power switch might simply stop working one day. So that I wouldn't be able to start the unit anymore.

2) what does the select button do, is that just basically the same as a select button would be on an NES controller but its on the unit instead of the joystick/joypad. Probably a stupid question but I am dying to know.

3) is it normal to get a garbled colored mess of a picture when trying games, that is usually all going on diagonals rather then horizontal and vertical. Hard to explain, but it's very odd looking. I almost always only get it on 2600 games, 7800 games usually load up fine. Sometimes just taking the cart out and putting it back in fixes it or sometimes, just restarting the system fixes it. Other times, it needs a cleaning, other times, nothing fixes it. Another image I sometimes get is a black image with very very fine white specks or spots randomly appearing on the screen. I get that almost as much as the garbled mess, usually from the same offending carts.

4) is a rolling picture (in my case, only one game, Donkey Kong 2600) a good sign that the cartridge may be a PAL cartridge. I have an NTSC USA system, I am from Florida. I can't see any UK/PAL or USA/NTSC markings on the cartridge at all to be sure. Tried cleaning it five times with the same result.

5) Is it normal for 2600 games to be fussy particularly with a 7800 system, I realize they are very old. I usually have to clean every NES game I get. But I've never had an NES game not work after at least a few cleanings. I have at least three 2600 games that seem like they aren't going to work again. Is that just the way it is considering the age of the 2600 cartridge or could it be the system, is perhaps the used system not in very good condition and its not playing cartridges that a good system would. On the flipside, at least so far, every 7800 game I've tried works on the first shot or at least the second shot. But those games, while old are not nearly as old as a 2600 game. Also while most of the 2600 games do require a little effort to work. I do have about two 2600 games out of 15 that seem to work really nicely just like the 7800 games. So it isn't like ever 2600 cart gives me a hard time. Just almost every one. Also note, I've cleaned every cart at least once with rubbing alcohol and a q-tip.

Ok sorry for the long topic and all the questions, but people on here who have dealt with Ataris alot, especially those who grew up with them, can help me to understand a little better, what I should expect and what I shouldn't expect from a 7800 and 2600/7800 games.

I appreciate any responses. Thanks
Robert

[8th lutz]

I am long time Atari 7800 owner. I got the system for Christmas in 1989 when I was in 5th grade and I got a Nes in 1991. Here is the answer to your questions.

1.) The power button isn't supposed to be finicky at all.

2.) same as a Nes select button.

3.) I had the same issues in the past with 2600 games and it is a normal issue.

4.) I have no idea.

5.) It depends on the publisher of the 2600 games and there could be one more factor. Atari 7800 has 3 different models during its lifetime and it could be a reason why you have problems with 2600 games. The version of the 7800 I has a more tight cartridge slot than older 7800 models do and it does make more difficult for getting some 2600 games to work as a result.

Edited by 8th lutz, Sat Dec 3, 2011 7:10 PM.

[jetset]

I can't speak for the system as a whole, but I've had two 7800's and the power button was a pain in the ass on both. On my current system I opened it up and cleaned the contact and it was fine for about maybe 10 clicks then it started getting bad again. I'd say it's par for the course for a 20+ year old system.

Edited by jetset, Sat Dec 3, 2011 7:14 PM.

[Robert Carrion]

Thanks for the replys and info. Well at least it seems 50/50 with the power button thing. I guess if it ever stopped working, I could open it and try to fix it. Eh, I'm lazy but you know if I have to. But why worry about it, it works. Doesn't work perfectly but it works. I think what I might do is get that Harmony cartridge SD flash cart and use that instead of these old 2600 carts, cause honestly, they stress me out. You go through all that work just to play a simple (and fun) old school game. Some carts fit tighter then others, but they all fit, I don't have really unique looking ones, I mean the most unique looking carts I have are the Donkey Kong carts, they are white. I've seen some of those really fancy wildly shaped carts though. But don't have any to play/test. Not yet anyway.

[Mayhem]

The power button on the NTSC 7800 I have is temperamental, and may take more than one press to register. Guess I need to open her up and check the contacts...

[Armonigann]

Robert Carrion, on Sat Dec 3, 2011 6:35 PM, said:

I got my Atari 7800 today and I have a few questions. First thing, go easy on me, I'm 28, my first system was an NES at 5 years old for Christmas. I remember how things work with systems I had over the years. Atari 7800 and any Atari previous I never owned, so I don't remember or know what should and shouldn't happen with a system. No doubt, if I grew up with an Atari 7800 I probably would know the answers to many of these questions already, just like I know what to expect with NES problems from memory. But I didn't grow up with it, so I can't tell what is perhaps problems due to age or just the way the units are. Even a new NES could be a picky. So thats why I am asking here to people who probably know alot about what is what with an Atari 7800, etc.

Ok questions:

1) Is the power button normally finicky or is that just my used unit I bought online, being a little broken down over the years. Times when I hit the power button and it doesn't shut off, other times it does. Basically I usually just keep trying to it works or doesn't work. Although it seems pushing it down hard to start and hard again to stop works most of the time. My other question in connection with that, if it is not normal, is it possible the power switch might simply stop working one day. So that I wouldn't be able to start the unit anymore.

2) what does the select button do, is that just basically the same as a select button would be on an NES controller but its on the unit instead of the joystick/joypad. Probably a stupid question but I am dying to know.

3) is it normal to get a garbled colored mess of a picture when trying games, that is usually all going on diagonals rather then horizontal and vertical. Hard to explain, but it's very odd looking. I almost always only get it on 2600 games, 7800 games usually load up fine. Sometimes just taking the cart out and putting it back in fixes it or sometimes, just restarting the system fixes it. Other times, it needs a cleaning, other times, nothing fixes it. Another image I sometimes get is a black image with very very fine white specks or spots randomly appearing on the screen. I get that almost as much as the garbled mess, usually from the same offending carts.

4) is a rolling picture (in my case, only one game, Donkey Kong 2600) a good sign that the cartridge may be a PAL cartridge. I have an NTSC USA system, I am from Florida. I can't see any UK/PAL or USA/NTSC markings on the cartridge at all to be sure. Tried cleaning it five times with the same result.

5) Is it normal for 2600 games to be fussy particularly with a 7800 system, I realize they are very old. I usually have to clean every NES game I get. But I've never had an NES game not work after at least a few cleanings. I have at least three 2600 games that seem like they aren't going to work again. Is that just the way it is considering the age of the 2600 cartridge or could it be the system, is perhaps the used system not in very good condition and its not playing cartridges that a good system would. On the flipside, at least so far, every 7800 game I've tried works on the first shot or at least the second shot. But those games, while old are not nearly as old as a 2600 game. Also while most of the 2600 games do require a little effort to work. I do have about two 2600 games out of 15 that seem to work really nicely just like the 7800 games. So it isn't like ever 2600 cart gives me a hard time. Just almost every one. Also note, I've cleaned every cart at least once with rubbing alcohol and a q-tip.

Ok sorry for the long topic and all the questions, but people on here who have dealt with Ataris alot, especially those who grew up with them, can help me to understand a little better, what I should expect and what I shouldn't expect from a 7800 and 2600/7800 games.

I appreciate any responses. Thanks
Robert

... KENNETH MARTIN DOLAN - SOCIAL SECURITY #..... Is that you?

[edweird13]

The power button is a problem on my 7800. If you don't know when the power button is flaky on a 2600/7800 you can get "frying effects". Meaning you can get weird effects if the power fluctuates on power up. this is what i have always done. insert the cart if it doesn't work try the power again. If it doesn't work again move the cart slightly and try again. Do this until the game works or stop and try another game. If you have ever owned an older cartridge system you know that if it don't work the first time mess with it a little til you can get it to work

[Robert Carrion]

edweird13, on Sun Dec 4, 2011 2:59 AM, said:

The power button is a problem on my 7800. If you don't know when the power button is flaky on a 2600/7800 you can get "frying effects". Meaning you can get weird effects if the power fluctuates on power up. this is what i have always done. insert the cart if it doesn't work try the power again. If it doesn't work again move the cart slightly and try again. Do this until the game works or stop and try another game. If you have ever owned an older cartridge system you know that if it don't work the first time mess with it a little til you can get it to work

Thanks edweird13, I'll give it a shot, I was too young for the Atari, my first was an NES at 5 years old. But that needed to messed with too. If I only knew that rubbing alcohol and Q-Tips were alot better then blowing into the cartridge and console. Well I would have saved alot of breath. But I will try the slight movement method on games that givem e trouble.

Armonigann, I have no idea who that is, why do you say?

[Underball]

8th lutz, on Sat Dec 3, 2011 6:59 PM, said:

I am long time Atari 7800 owner. I got the system for Christmas in 1989 when I was in 5th grade and I got a Nes in 1991. Here is the answer to your questions.

1.) The power button isn't supposed to be finicky at all.

2.) same as a Nes select button.

3.) I had the same issues in the past with 2600 games and it is a normal issue.

4.) I have no idea.

5.) It depends on the publisher of the 2600 games and there could be one more factor. Atari 7800 has 3 different models during its lifetime and it could be a reason why you have problems with 2600 games. The version of the 7800 I has a more tight cartridge slot than older 7800 models do and it does make more difficult for getting some 2600 games to work as a result.

To amend the above answers:

1.) The power button isn't supposed to be finicky, but very often due to oxidation under the dome and contacts do get fouled, and need to cleaned or better yet, replaced. It's not just the power button, either. Any or all of the 4 console buttons can and will exhibit this problem over time. I would recommend replacing them. replacement parts can be found at Radio Cellphone Shack or any decent electronics supplier. I can't tell you how many used eBay 7800's I've owned or repaired for others that have this problem. is it VERY common among 7800 consoles in the wild.

2.) nothing on an atari Console is the same as a NES. Teh select button has different uses per game. Some games don't use it at all. some games use it to cycle through difficulty levels or # of players. Some games use it in-game as another button. Best to consult each game's manual for it's use.

3.) It is a common issue. It's usually due to one of three things: fouled cart contacts in your 7800's cart slot, fouled contacts on the 2600 cart board, or in some cases the cart is dead due to bit rot in the actual ROM chips. Also - some brands of games (activistion in particular) used slightly thinner cartridge boards, so teh don't fit as snugly in the cart slot as they should. the slightest movement can kill a game or make it not start properly. There really isn't much you can do about this, besides making sire the cart port contacts are as clean as you can get them.

4.) yes, a rolling picture is usually an indication of a PAL cart.

5.) Yes. it is common. Clean the car contacts and 7800 port contacts as best you can. Not much else you can do. use a Q-tip and 70% isoproyl alcohol.

[Robert Carrion]

Thanks for the info, I will try everything stated, Cellphone Shack...ha, so true.

[Lendorien]

1) No, it's not normal. Wear and tear can make the switches dodgy, which is what your issue is. I replaced all of the buttons on my 7800. It took a desoldering iron to remove them and a little soldering to put the new ones in, but it works like new now. I would suggest it to anyone who has a little soldering skill. It totally revamped my system. The switch is still available. You can get it from Mouser Electronics here.

2) The select button is for switching game modes, usually in Atari 2600 games, but also some 7800 games as well. A couple games use the switch for gameplay.

3) What underball said.

4) Pal Carts will roll on the screen and appear as Black and White.

5) Could be that the contacts in the 7800 are dirty. That sort of effects seem to come from dirty contacts. But bad carts, though uncommon are not an impossibility either.

Edited by Lendorien, Sun Dec 4, 2011 11:45 PM.

[Robert Carrion]

I dunno, more and more, I'm starting to think my 7800 I bought was a junker. It fights me on playing 2600 games, I mean fights me. I almost never can get a 2600 game to play straight away. But most games it fights me and I lose. Cleaning doesn't work. Games that work, suddenly won't work. But always 2600 games, never 7800 games. They work great. I wonder how its possible that nearly every 2600 game and I have about 15. How they always give me hell, while the 7800 games work great. I can't believe that a system would be this painful. I shouldn't have to work up a sweat to play a game of Berzerk

[Propane13]

I've sometimes had it where for some games to work, I have to "push them forward" a little bit, to make the circuit board contact a little bit better.
I'm curious-- are the 2600 games in question Activision games, mostly?

[Robert Carrion]

Virtually every 2600 game, it just so happens about half of my 2600 games are Activision games yes. But there is also some Atari games, ones with the closed bottom. Pole Position gives me trouble. I have two coleco made Donkey Kong and Donkey Kong Jr white Cartridge games, one works decently well, Jr. though it starts garbled and I have to reset it for some reason for it to start. Donkey Kong gives me a rolling picture. Basically anything 2600 gives me some sort of grief. 7800 games work well, some work straight away, others I might need to take out and reinstall..then they work. Thats equal to a Nintendo for me. Thats how an NES works. Here and there, you have to pull it out, occasionally clean it. Thats that. But 2600 games though are brutal to get to work. The hard thing is, since I only have this one system, never owned any Atari in my life to really remember or compare it with. I don't know if it is the system, the cartridge or both. If I had 3 units lying around, then I'd know, I could compare. If I had an Atari when I was younger, I'd remember how things went. But I don't. I'll try your recommendation of pushing forward a little bit when possible but at this point, my hopes are way low. I had a copy of Freeway that worked perfectly two days ago. Now, it gives me vertical bold colored lines. Will not start. What happened between two days and today for it to not work. I tried pulling out and putting back in many times, I tried cleaning. It suddenly won't work anymore.

[Robert Carrion]

I will say this, the pulling it forward method, while turning it on, does help for 4 out 5 games. Is there a way to fix this though, that I don't have to always be pulling it forward, because I can't hold it forward all the time and play a game. Also since it seems like the 7800 portion works well, but the 2600 portion is problematic, would buying the Harmony flash cart help or would that be risky. Another words, would it be far more reliable then your average old 2600 cart, that I just pop it in and it works. Then I've got a menu full of the roms to play. Or would it be prone to the same problems that are effecting the 2600 carts I currently have. Keep in mind, its not just Activision carts, most of my 2600 carts are giving me grief, Activision or not. I would buy a Harmony cart but I would hate to spend $80 and it doesn't work right on the unit just like every other 2600 cart seems to be tempermental with my 7800 unit.

[jferio]

Another things that can cause intermittent failures of 2600 games - check your power supply. 9V, 1A is what the power supply should be rated for.

[Robert Carrion]

It is a 9V output but not a real original battery pack, its an AtariGuide.com replacement. I didn't see any 1A markings though.

[Propane13]

Yeah, I'm guessing it's the contacts in your system that are temperamental. If the "pull it in a direction and hold it" method works, that means that the power is fine, the game is fine, but the connection between the two of them isn't what it used to be. A new system may be a solution, but I thought of another possible workaround.

If you bought the high-score-cart or a soon-to-be-released XM module, and that had a good connection to the system (since they're relatively new peripherals), you would likely have the 2600 games work through that middle-man. Just a thought.

-John

[Robert Carrion]

Thanks, I'll look into those high score cart and XM modules. How do you think a Harmony cart would work on a 2600? Given that it would be new and clean. Would it work well or do you think it would have problems like the normal 2600 games

[Underball]

The Harmony Cart works great with the 7800. In fact, all the finicky 2600 carts I have the have the same problems you're describing work perfect from the Harmony.

[Robert Carrion]

Thanks Underball, thats reassuring, I am looking to get one from Atariage. They seem awesome.

Is there anyway to tighten up or fix the connectors so the "pull forward" method can be eliminated or reduced. Another words a better connection between the cart and system. Because I've found that while it's not perfect, it does help alot to pull the games forward. But the moment I let go, the image scrambles. I tried opening the machine to see if the slot could be disconnected for cleaning or tigtened, and it feels like it is welded onto the motherboard. Is there any way to actually try and improve upon that using home repair. Or is it just absolutely, your screwed, get another 7800 console sort of deal. Let me say, while at least the console I have has been a pain, when it works, its a ton of fun. I love it. But it doesn't work much unfortunately.

[Propane13]

I actually could use the answer to this myself. But, I'm not a hardware guy-- I'm a software guy.
Has anyone ever replaced the cartridge port on a 7800, or found a way to make it have "better contact" with some games?

[Rik]

I have 2 7800's, one with the expansion hole/slot on the side, and the one without.I love this system.The only problem I have in common with yours is the stubborn power switch, where I have to press hard or 2 -3 times for system the power up.Other than that, superb system!!!

[Trebor]

Lendorien, on Sun Dec 4, 2011 11:39 PM, said:

1) No, it's not normal. Wear and tear can make the switches dodgy, which is what your issue is. I replaced all of the buttons on my 7800. It took a desoldering iron to remove them and a little soldering to put the new ones in, but it works like new now. I would suggest it to anyone who has a little soldering skill. It totally revamped my system. The switch is still available. You can get it from Mouser Electronics here.

THANK YOU for the above link. I just purchased a bunch of switches to fix a unit I recently bought, and for the future.