44 replies to this topic

[Metal Ghost]

That quote was taken from the last paragraph of a Gamasutra article put up today.

Even with the Wii U expected to debut in 9 months or so, I really hadn't thought of it like that.

I know that the retail life that a console has left in it can vary pretty greatly once its successor is announced. Saturn was effectively killed off 2 years prior to the launch of the Dreamcast, while the PS2 was still going strong years after the PS3 launched.

Still, given the shear number of Wii consoles out in the wild, I certainly didn't think we were looking at another Saturn here. And again, it's not as if the Wii U launch is right around the corner....it's the 2nd have of 2012, and I could easily see that becoming 4th quarter.

At the same time, while my in-laws have a Wii, I don't, and therefore I don't really keep track of software launches on that platform.

What do you guys think? Are we essentially looking at an abandoned Wii platform from here on out?

[cimerians]

When you announce a new system it generally is.

I don't look for any new releases on it like I used to. I think the only new worthwhile game I've played is Zelda. I tried that Streets Monopoly game and it was pretty much rubbish.

If the Wii had the power of a 360 or PS3 at launch with all the 3rd party support and an acceptable online store\community then Nintendo would be ruling the world right now.

If Mario\Zelda\Metroid were available on an iPad or an Android device they would be dead. Nobody would NEED a DS\3DS, nobody would NEED their console.

They are litterally clinging to those characters and the nostolgic NES games.

[revolutionika]

i read an article that nintendo would still suport wii anfter wii u has out.

im sure they will drop the price to 79 to 99 and keep releasing party and wii play type of games to the masses. why wouldnt they?

but to the 'hardcore' they may as well be dead. Zelda being the last game for the hardcore in my opinion.

[Reaperman]

What's odd is that we seem to have multiple abandoned systems this gen. Usually late-gen games are great for being quirky, collectible, and great fun. Now systems turn into ghost towns 1+ year before the next one is even released for seemingly no reason.


What about Kirby? He was a post-snes, nes release and he was viable.
And PS2 got some of its best RPGs after ps3 came out.
One could even lump gamecube's last zelda game into the mix.

Given Nintendo's recent history of console shortages, we need something to buy for our hardware a solid year *after* wiiU launches, and there's just been next to nothing.

Edited by Reaperman, Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:12 PM.

[Rex Dart]

cimerians, on Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:58 AM, said:

If Mario\Zelda\Metroid were available on an iPad or an Android device they would be dead. Nobody would NEED a DS\3DS, nobody would NEED their console.

They are litterally clinging to those characters and the nostolgic NES games.

Right, a $3 picture-matching game would just obliterate the 3DS. Anyways, the Wii's pretty much dead, at least as far as Nintendo's concerned. Maybe some third parties have some ideas left, I don't know. Remember back when Nintendo said they'd support the GBA alongside its successor? Didn't last long.

[godslabrat]

I thought it was abandoned years ago by the trillions of gamers who said they were sick of it and never played it and it was collecting dust. But now, suddenly, it's a problem when no new games are on the way?

[Hyper_Eye]

It still has plenty of games that I intend to get through at some point and they don't feel dated to me yet. But if Nintendo is mostly done with it maybe they have released their last system update that effectively does nothing more than target the Homebrew Channel and other modifications. The HBC elevates the Wii.

I think the trajectory the Wii took is amazing. It looked like it was unstoppable and people were predicting it would outsell the PS2 before the end of its life. Then its trajectory kind of dropped off and suddenly nobody was really interested anymore. I think a couple of changes could have made a big difference.

[Reaperman]

godslabrat, on Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:11 PM, said:

I thought it was abandoned years ago by the trillions of gamers who said they were sick of it and never played it and it was collecting dust. But now, suddenly, it's a problem when no new games are on the way?

I don't know what's sudden about it. The library on that system has had complaints since launch, and it's simply dropped below more people's standards.

When I pretend that I'm a regular Nintendo customer, I can't figure out what I'm supposed to buy from them right now, and Nintendo should be seeing that as a problem.

[ComputerSpaceFan]

From what I've heard (on IGN's Nintendo podcast) the only things left to come out for Wii are Rhythm Heaven and Fortune Street. Xenoblade is finally coming but the folks at IGN think it won't sell well in North America and if it doesn't the other two (Last Story and .. what's the other one?) won't come stateside.

And that's it.

Maybe, just maybe we might get some final Pokemon or Naruto type stuff, but first and second party support seems to be trailing off. And third party dropped support ages ago (with a few exceptions like Need for Speed the Run and Oregon Trail).

If you ask me, Nintendo are leaving themselves really vulnerable. The only thing fuelling their profits seems to be 3DS. The WiiU is a long way off. And from the comments I have heard (for example the G4 podcast called "Feedback") a lot of the gaming press is less than excited about WiiU, who knows if customers will be. Nintendo are in a bit of a bad spot I think.

Then again they were at the end of the GameCube era and look how things turned around for them. Who would have expected that to happen?

[NE146]

Well if you believe everybody, considering it's really a Gamecube which came out in 2001, I think it's friggin DUE It had an awesome run.

[MagitekAngel]

The problems endemic to Wii for me go deeper than it suddenly being developmentally dead or plagued with shovelware.

One problem, and it's a big one that has extended to other Nintendo consoles, is that their first party games take forever to come down in price. When a console is this late in its lifespan, it's usually the perfect time for collectors and late adopters to go back through old releases and fill out their collections. Typically, most of the A list games that have come out during the life time of the console will have by now descended to the 10-20 dollar range brand new, so consumers can afford to scoop them up by the armful and build an instant library of great games.

Ideally, this is where the Wii should shine, because to set aside third-party shovelware complaints for a moment, the Wii has one of the largest and strongest first-party libraries ever seen on one console in recent memory. Nintendo games, however, simply don't depreciate. Until Nintendo finally rolled out their red-label "Nintendo selects" reprints last year, Twilight Princess was still 60 dollars new. New Super Mario Bros Wii is still 65 at my local EB Games. Mario Kart Wii, Super Smash Bros Brawl, Super Mario Galaxy 2, and Donkey Kong Country returns are all still going for their original retail prices. Hell, Kirby's Epic Yarn actually costs more at my local EB than the new Kirby game.

These games only go down when Nintendo gives them the Player's Choice branding, and this generation, even that effort has been appalling. Only nine games out of the entire library (and not all of them for the same region) are on the list after more than five years. There were nearly a hundred Player's choice games on Gamecube by the end of its life.

There is simply no incentive for late adopters on Wii. They might get a cheaper console, but they'll be paying nearly the same price for all the games and accessories.

Another problem with Nintendo is their reluctance to bundle games together or release anthologies. Towards the end of the PS2's period of market dominance, we started seeing some really nice 3-game bundles on the cheap, like Metal Gear Solid, Mortal Kombat, and even Dragonball Z. Nowadays, to promote the third Gears game, Microsoft bundles the first two games at a discount. Sony does the same thing for Resistance and Killzone.

Nintendo never does anything like this. I'd love to get my hands on a copy of Metroird Prime Trilogy - the only good first-party (okay, second) compilation I can think of on Wii, but Nintendo pulled that one after a couple of months, and now the game goes for hundreds on eBay. The only other Nintendo "effort" I can recall was the equally-limited-run Super Mario All-Stars, which was nothing more than a 17 year-old SNES ROM image pressed onto a Wii disc and sold with a booklet for thirty bucks.

The point I'm trying to make here, is that not only is the Wii entirely dependent upon its first-party support, but that said first-party support is actively working against itself as far as drawing in consumers and giving them their money's worth. This has been my main issue with Wii, long before the well was ever in danger of running dry.

Edited by MagitekAngel, Tue Jan 17, 2012 1:00 PM.

[Cybergoth]

I abandoned it in late 2010 already.

[Reaperman]

Why is WiiU backwards compatible if they're killing wii a year before its release?

If I were nintendo I'd take a page from the gb->gbc playbook. Make Wii++ games that I can buy/play *now* on my existing hardware, and give them some additional features when played on a WiiU--then I have motivation to buy now, and at least a little incentive to upgrade later on. Maybe they don't have the WiiU hardware finalized enough for that yet.

I will buy xenoblade though. It's not my ideal game, but it screams 'collectible'

[Rex Dart]

If the Wii-U could only play Wii games at or above 720p, that would be plenty. Xenoblade looks like a damn xbox 360 title if you play it at 720p.

[ComputerSpaceFan]

MagitekAngel, on Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:58 PM, said:

their first party games take forever to come down in price... Hell, Kirby's Epic Yarn actually costs more at my local EB than the new Kirby game.

Next time I'm in my local EB Games I should take a picture. They have Wii Punch Out "Nintendo Selects" (the new budget $20 version with the red border) sitting right beside Wii Punch Out, used, for $49.99

[Animan]

revolutionika, on Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:59 AM, said:

i read an article that nintendo would still suport wii anfter wii u has out.

im sure they will drop the price to 79 to 99 and keep releasing party and wii play type of games to the masses. why wouldnt they?

but to the 'hardcore' they may as well be dead. Zelda being the last game for the hardcore in my opinion.

Um, Xenoblade Chronicles, anyone?

[eggomania]

It doesn't surprise me that the Wii is pretty much dead. Nintendo has a history of killing their systems once the newest one is announced. The same thing will happen with Wii U years from now - providing Nintendo will continue making consoles.

What's really frustrating is that Nintendo has all of these systems that sold very well with no new games for them. Look at Atari 2600 - it stopped making new games in 1989 but homebrews are still being made. It would be nice to see Nintendo have homebrew games. That way, these old systems can continue to introduce new games.

[Tr3vor]

Besides Xenoblade, I havn't been hearing much about the wii at all. I think its nearly in its deathbed.

[Austin]

All right guys, so when are all the massive price drops and liquidations going to start?? My wallet's ready!

[Shawn Sr.]

Austin, on Tue Jan 17, 2012 9:30 PM, said:

All right guys, so when are all the massive price drops and liquidations going to start?? My wallet's ready!

Exactly what I was thinking cause I'm not buying into this Wii U thing AT ALL.

[save2600]

I was old of the Wii within the first two years (or less) of its release and got rid of mine within said time frame. Floaty controls and the big headed kiddie thing kinda freaked me out.

[davepesc]

People don't really understand what Wii U is. It's not "Wii 2" or some other new name. I work with 3rd-6th grade kids and most of them think it's a new handheld.

EDIT, to add to the discussion, Wii has been dead to me for years. SMG was one of the best games this gen, but I can't think of a single other game I've bought that I spent any significant time playing. Mario Kart is good, and to a lesser extent, SSB:B, although I prefer Melee.

Edited by davepesc, Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:59 PM.

[AtariLeaf]

I have a VERY different viewpoint. I love the Wii, I think its the best console since the 16 bit era. The party games and shovelware that everyone derides is exactly the kind of gaming experience I've been looking for in a modern console. My wife and I were playing basketball in Sports Resort and had a blast. I will take that experience over sitting alone in a room with a headset, a bag of cheetos and f-boming some stranger halfway around the world while playing some gory FPS.

In fact the first party Wii games are the ones I'm LEAST interested in. I'd rather pick up Carnival games than Super Mario Galaxy. No contest for me. Its the kind of gamer I am. I enjoy the simple pick up and play games - it reminds me of the reason I still enjoy playing Atari.

[LynxVGL]

Reaperman, on Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:08 PM, said:

What's odd is that we seem to have multiple abandoned systems this gen. Usually late-gen games are great for being quirky, collectible, and great fun. Now systems turn into ghost towns 1+ year before the next one is even released for seemingly no reason.

I think system death has to deal with the time required by Developers to create good titles. Your average AAA title has a huge development team and the creation of Art & Programming Assets takes a time. A good title generally has a minimum of 12-18 months on it. (I stress GOOD game). So when a Developer has to choose which profit stream to gamble on, they have to drop one gen and move on to another. If you look at other publishers & developers, the Wii U is going to get Arkham City, COD, and other current gen best sellers, just ported to the new platform. We haven't heard too many rumors of titles from other developers besides HD Zelda, which kind of indicates that while Devs may have the hardware, they are feeeling it out to see what they can do. Again, something that takes time to do.

The backward compatibility of the Wii U is a marketing ploy like the PS2 backward compatibility. Most Wii owners are clumped into the "Casual" gamer clump, so the marketing angle (IMHO) is that they don't have to dump their Wii Software collection when they "upgrade" to a new console. That approach worked in the PS2/Xbox/GameCube gen, but I don't know how much weight it bears now.

[sidcrazy]

When the Gamecube was nearing its end the same thing happened. We still got a version of Twilight Princess. But that was it, everything else got shifted to the Wii. Super Paper Mario for example, and a few other titles moved to the Wii.

I like the Wii honestly, but I don't rally around consoles like I use too. I purchased a PS3 and I still like it, but not for the reasons I thought I would. Everyone has their favorites, but in the end I buy a console for the games, not for anything else. Every time I buy into the hype of systems I always end up with a very expensive paperweight.