40 replies to this topic

[Mayhem]

That was mainly due to Commodore's insistence on pricing the disk drive so blimming expensive in the UK. By around 1987, it was more expensive than the computer itself. When the Excellerator/Oceanic clone appeared, the price of the 1541 dropped unsurprisingly. And then Commodore tried to get it banned.

[TMR]

Phredreeke, on Fri Jan 27, 2012 10:42 AM, said:

I'm not british but from my understanding the BBC Micro wasn't popular in homes because of its high pricepoint, although it was the de facto school computer (due to the support of the public broadcaster which it gets its name from) In homes the ZX Spectrum, Commodore 64 and Amstrad CPC were more common.

They were and in that order too; the Spectrum sold the most, then the C64 and finally the Amstrad CPC which was somethng of a latecomer and actually shares a CRTC with the Beeb. The image the BBC had of being for education (from both the high visibility in schools and it's flagship position for a lot of the BBC's computer training output like Making The Most Of The Micro) tended to scare kids away from asking for one but the price tag did the same for their parents anyway.

high voltage, on Sat Jan 28, 2012 5:23 AM, said:

Spectrum doesn't do disks, so C64 has to suffer tapes too. WHSmith was tapes galore

Actually, that's not really accurate; the Spectrum did do disks but Sinclair didn't so, until Amstrad took over and released the +3, there was no standard disk interface to publish for.

A percentage of C64 owners did have a drive but, because it was cheaper to aim for the lowest common denominator, companies usually produced for tape-based machines because then everybody could buy their game and the mass production was cheaper; that's probably why there were some very high-profile groups operating out of the UK cracking the companies' output to disk.

[Sanriostar]

I think the article is trying to say that there were not specific C64GS carts that came out. Other than the International Soccer, I'm not aware of any. I'll let the posts below correct me if I'm wrong.

[chuckwalla]

I'll add my 1 cent to this topic and mention that if AtariMax did a C64 Multicart like the Atari 8-bit i'd be among the first to buy it...

[high voltage]

Sanriostar, on Thu Feb 2, 2012 8:16 PM, said:

I think the article is trying to say that there were not specific C64GS carts that came out. Other than the International Soccer, I'm not aware of any. I'll let the posts below correct me if I'm wrong.

The article states C64 and IS was one of the first C64 carts, not C64GS.
Maybe Mayhem's 400+ cart collection will make you aware of some more?

Dunno, I lived in UK during the 80s with a C128 and 2 fdds, which I still own nowadays. I managed to purchase any UK software title on disk from many UKs gaming shops, even WHSmith or Boots or Rumblelows. Ok budget titles excluded...
You had to have a fdd or how else would you run titles from US companies like Infocom, Origin or Sir-tech? Unthinkable.

Edited by high voltage, Fri Feb 3, 2012 7:27 AM.

[high voltage]

Mayhem, on Sat Jan 28, 2012 12:36 PM, said:

That was mainly due to Commodore's insistence on pricing the disk drive so blimming expensive in the UK. By around 1987, it was more expensive than the computer itself. When the Excellerator/Oceanic clone appeared, the price of the 1541 dropped unsurprisingly. And then Commodore tried to get it banned.

The 1050 was always double the price of th A8 even in UK but most A8 users had a 1050. Look at USA how much The Disk (drive) was compared to the Apple II. Lame excuse...

[Mayhem]

The difference being, in regards to being a C64 owner, was that most of the good stuff was still available on tape. Unlike the US where tape was essentially dead by 1985. There was no "incentive" to force people into must purchasing a disk drive for the machine. As for myself, I didn't get a disk drive until 1991, and then played a bit of catchup on releases I'd missed. Like the SSI RPGs.

[high voltage]

You're joking...not til 91? Man, that sucks.

I once played Summer Games II on tape with a bunch of friends. That multi-load spoiled the whole excitement of game play.

[save2600]

chuckwalla, on Thu Feb 2, 2012 8:54 PM, said:

I'll add my 1 cent to this topic and mention that if AtariMax did a C64 Multicart like the Atari 8-bit i'd be among the first to buy it...

I don't forsee AtariMax going CommodoreMax anytime soon...

[TMR]

high voltage, on Fri Feb 3, 2012 7:24 AM, said:

Mayhem, on Sat Jan 28, 2012 12:36 PM, said:

That was mainly due to Commodore's insistence on pricing the disk drive so blimming expensive in the UK. By around 1987, it was more expensive than the computer itself. When the Excellerator/Oceanic clone appeared, the price of the 1541 dropped unsurprisingly. And then Commodore tried to get it banned.

The 1050 was always double the price of th A8 even in UK but most A8 users had a 1050.

i'd question the "most A8 users" there because that's certainly not what i saw and it wasn't until i started chatting with folks who'd previously been involved in the A8 cracking scene that i met people who'd owned disk drives; there was a vast number of 800XLs flooded onto the market by Dixons in the mid 1980s for about £80 and many people buying those wouldn't have had enough disposable income to afford a 1050.

Tape was more unwieldy on the A8 than the C64 though, so those painfully long loading times may well have forced a higher percentage of users to make the transition.

[Sanriostar]

chuckwalla, on Thu Feb 2, 2012 8:54 PM, said:

I'll add my 1 cent to this topic and mention that if AtariMax did a C64 Multicart like the Atari 8-bit i'd be among the first to buy it...

Like this?
http://www.vesalia.de/e_chameleon.htm

[Hatta]

Aren't most C64 cartridge games available as PRGs?

[Mayhem]

high voltage, on Fri Feb 3, 2012 12:00 PM, said:

You're joking...not til 91? Man, that sucks.

I was 17, able to put some money aside to help pay for one, and the rest came from my father, who found someone at work who was selling an Oceanic, a printer, Freeze Machine, and a bunch of applications and EPROMs. First thing I did after that point was get an AR6 and freeze copied a bunch of single load tapes to disk. Not long after that point I found some swapping contacts and got hold of some games I hadn't been able to play by that point (such as Great Giana Sisters) and stuff released in mainland Europe.

Hatta, on Sat Feb 4, 2012 10:14 AM, said:

Aren't most C64 cartridge games available as PRGs?

From people who've dumped them, such as myself. I think all known cartridges have been dumped, bar that learning game that TopDog has.

[Clock]

When I lived in the UK (I moved to Australia in 2006) I had all of the above mentioned home computers back in their day (plus many other lesser known ones) and I remember having 3 game cartridges for the C64. I don't remember the titles but one was indeed International Football by Commodore. We also had the hacking carts (their were at least 2 brands) which allowed easy access to the code in games so we could alter them lol. I also had the 1540 disc block and one of the later 3rd party drives (can't remember the brand but I think it began with an E). The C64 without a disc drive was only half the computer it could be. I was part of a 4 man programming team which made indie games and demo's on the C64, we got pretty well known on the europeon hacking scene, I probably still have some 5.25 discs knocking around back home (in the UK) with a lot of our games and demo's on.

With note to Sinclair Sectrums, they in fact had a microdrive system instead of a disc drive (back in the rubber keyboard days), of course as stated Amstrad took over and ruined it, and they added an unusual disc drive to the +3 model (I think it was a 3inch disc rather than a 3.5).

With extra note to popularity of 8 bit machines in the UK The 48k spectrum was by far the most popular due to its budget price and huge software range, The Commodore 64 was 2nd and their position got stronger with each year, then in the earlier days it would have been the BBC model B but high price hit sales badly, so Acorn released the Electron which sold fairly well for a short time, Amstrad came to 8 bit computing a bit late and had some success with the cpc and made Amstrad the 3rd most successful 8 bit computer with their CPC models. Other noteworthy meantions from the earlier days would have to be the ZX81, Dragon 32, Oric Atom, Texas Ti99 and the MSX all of which had some fleeting success, but all short lived. The Dragon was probably the best machine of that list, but the Welsh company went bust I think.

[high voltage]

You forgot the XL, came third in the UK alongside CPC, actually second most sold import computer after C64

Edited by high voltage, Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:08 AM.

[TMR]

Clock, on Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:33 AM, said:

We also had the hacking carts (their were at least 2 brands) which allowed easy access to the code in games so we could alter them lol.

The two developed the UK were the Action Replay and Expert, but we had three or four others from abroad as well (although the AR5/6 was probably the best of its kind for the C64 until the Retro Replay arrived...)

Clock, on Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:33 AM, said:

I also had the 1540 disc block and one of the later 3rd party drives (can't remember the brand but I think it began with an E).

Probably an Excellerator+

Clock, on Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:33 AM, said:

The C64 without a disc drive was only half the computer it could be. I was part of a 4 man programming team which made indie games and demo's on the C64, we got pretty well known on the europeon hacking scene, I probably still have some 5.25 discs knocking around back home (in the UK) with a lot of our games and demo's on.

Go on then, which group? And odds are there'll be people in the C64 scene wanting to archive those disks. =-)

Clock, on Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:33 AM, said:

With note to Sinclair Sectrums, they in fact had a microdrive system instead of a disc drive (back in the rubber keyboard days), of course as stated Amstrad took over and ruined it, and they added an unusual disc drive to the +3 model (I think it was a 3inch disc rather than a 3.5).

There were also a couple of disk interfaces like the Opus Discovery available from third parties.

Clock, on Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:33 AM, said:

Other noteworthy meantions from the earlier days would have to be the ZX81, Dragon 32, Oric Atom

Atmos, the Atom was by Acorn. =-)