30 replies to this topic

[Foxy Cleopatra]

So I am reading through the new Electronic Gaming magazine, checking on what titles will be coming out this year, and it pretty much looks like a release list from.. well any year out of the past 5, 6, whatever...
ok PS2 will have 2 new FF one online (possibly Japan only) one not, GT4, Resident Evil:Network, Silent Hill 3, Tomb Raider 6,000,001, Driver 3 (but that'll be on all 3 systems)
XBox Halo 2 (eagerly awaited! ) Perfect Dark Zero, Project Gotham Racing 2, another Star Wars game (sigh), Driver 3
GC Zelda (also eagerly awaited) F-Zero, FF:Crystal Chronicles, Mario, Mario, Pikmin2, Pokemon, Starfox, Driver 3
And I know each will have even more sequels that weren't listed
I understand the logic, if you've got a winner capitalize on it as much as you can, even though the outcome may not be great (DMC2 anyone?) but I'm getting very bored...
I just hope Fable and that P.N. 03 will be as great as they are saying
Does the gaming industry need some fresh game designers?

[Miqorz]

Because one good game deserves another.

But yeah there are several games I'd love sequels to.

[StanJr]

Yeah, sequels are cool and all, but I wish they didn't come at the cost of new and different games. At least we are past the Fighter/Sports game gridlock of several years ago...

[Punisher5.0]

I'll take a Nintendo sequel over most companies new games.

[Linkin Park]

The answer to the question "Why all the sequals?" is that companies make a good game, realize its good, and then try to improve it and make a sequal to get more money from the lil legacy they created. Kinda cheesy if you ask me...

But hey, if you dont like sequals, just look back at FF, if they would stopped at one or two, we wouldnt have 7-10. And THPS. The first one was OK, but they kept goin, and now its actually pretty cool.

Sequals rock

[Happy_Dude]

Basicaly if you want an original game that isn't a sequal, import some
of that crazy s*** from japan that wasn't exiting enough for the overseas market
They still know how to make an "original" game

[chrisbid]

lack of sequels are one of the reasons the dreamcast died

[Kid Fenris]

Frankly, I don't think the sequel problem is any worse than it's been in years past, and there are a number of unique titles out there. Disaster Report, the Getaway, Cubivore, the Mark of Kri, GunValkyrie, .hack, Crimson Sea, Car Battler Joe, and Skygunner spring to mind.

And the future holds stuff like Viewtiful Joe, Disgaea, Color Quest, Alter Echo, Kingdom Under Fire, and Glass Rose. Original games are always there if you're willing to look for them.

[Foxy Cleopatra]

Kid Fenris said:

Frankly, I don't think the sequel problem is any worse than it's been in years past, and there are a number of unique titles out there.  Disaster Report, the Getaway, Cubivore, the Mark of Kri, GunValkyrie, .hack, Crimson Sea, Car Battler Joe, and Skygunner spring to mind.

And the future holds stuff like Viewtiful Joe, Disgaea, Color Quest, Alter Echo, Kingdom Under Fire, and Glass Rose.  Original games are always there if you're willing to look for them.

Yea I know, but the one's that are receiving all the promoting are the sequel games, most of the ones you mention aren't getting much ad time. So the industry keeps pumping out all those games that have been done before in the hopes of making a S***load of money.
I mean, lord, Mario has been around almost as long as me, don't you think it's time to throw him a retirement party, buy him a gold watch and bring in some fresh faces? There were what 1,000,000 Mario games on the N64? You'd go into Wal-Mart and the case would have fifty boxes with that little Italian guys face on it. It looks like the same thing is starting to happen across the board.

[Ze_ro]

chrisbid said:

lack of sequels are one of the reasons the dreamcast died

What are you talking about? The Dreamcast had tons of sequels... but what really got me into the system were odd, unique games that Sega would come out with (Jet Grind Radio, Crazy Taxi, Sambo de Amigo, Typing of the Dead, etc...)

Pretty much every successful Dreamcast game (such as Sonic Adventure, Crazy Taxi, Space Channel 5, Shenmue, etc) had sequels when you think about it. Plus, many sequels to all-around popular games (like Tony Hawk, Rayman, Tomb Raider, Street Fighter, Resident Evil, etc), as well as games that were sequels to games the DC didn't even have (Soul Calibur, Dead or Alive 2, Bomberman Online, Virtua Fighter 3tb, etc)

--Zero

[chrisbid]

i was reffering to sequels from older Sega series. Sonic seemed to be the only old sega franchise to make its way to the dreamcast. I liked the unique titles too, but after sonic, there wasnt much the system had to offer that casual gamers were familiar with. Streets of Rage 4 was in the works, ToeJam and Earl 3 was supposed to be for Dreamcast, Nights never made its way to DC, Panzer Dragoon, Shinobi and several other great games never were considered. Its not the only reason the DC died, but it certainly didnt help its cause.

[MegaManFan]

I for one couldn't be happier they made a Dark Cloud 2. I can't wait to get it.

[somePUNK]

i personally am waiting for may i can't wait to get scilent hill 3 it sounds amazing and 2 was great even better than one

[MegaManFan]

somePUNK said:

i personally am waiting for may i can't wait to get scilent hill 3 it sounds amazing and 2 was great even better than one

That GI article was sure a trip. "99% of the publicity photos they sent us are so gruesome, we can't even show them in these pages." If they're serious and that's not hype on their behalf, DAMN :!:

[Vic George 2K3]

These days, it's really hard to determine what can be legitimately called a sequel game, since we also have spin-off games, prequel games, games that contain characters from a familiar game series, and just plain rehashes of last year's games (in particular, the EA Madden and hockey and basketball games, where the most change you'll ever really see are the statistical rosters). It didn't help during the time Nintendo was supporting at least three different game systems at the same time when a so-called "sequel game" would appear on a system different than the one its predecessor appeared on, which can really make a game collector and/or historian wonder where these games would really fit into the series they're supposed to be part of. I don't really know what more I can say on the issue.

[Foxy Cleopatra]

Vic George 2K2 said:

just plain rehashes of last year's games (in particular, the EA Madden and hockey and basketball games, where the most change you'll ever really see are the statistical rosters).

Oh don't get me started on sports games! They don't even count as entertainment as far as I am concerned. Go outside and actually play the game....

[Brad2600]

Yes they do, Foxy.

I don't see the need for sequels myself as the games industry lacks innovation in many ways.

For example, compare it to the pharmeutical industry. They're constantly coming out with drugs that are similar or no better than drugs that have been released and marketed to the public ahead of time. It's no longer about innovation, but rather about profits and padding the wallets of the contagious fat cats that run pharmeutical companies. Profit =desire and desire= profit.

Software companies just feel that by recycling the same old ideas, that profit is guaranteed and just enough so they can write financial reports ahead of time that guarantee that they will keep their wallets full. No matter how bad the sequel is, they will manage to dupe a nation of clueless software buyers into buying into the hoax they are advertising. Innovation is no longer profitable. Hence, people feel the need to keep repetition in their daily routines. If they enjoyed Tomb Raider 57, then they will automatically enjoy Tomb Raider 58 as they have been programmed and stripped of their senses. In other words, they will follow without questioning the asethetical structure of what they are doing.

In other words, they need less sequels and more games that are innovative. Hell, Grand Theft Auto:Vice is not much different from GTA3. It's not better in any way. Sure, there's better weapons and a different story. It's still not very innovative.

This would spell the end of the games industry as we know it. Where have the David Cranes of the software world gone? This is exactly what led to the great videogame crash of 1983. Less innovation and more repetition. I predict a similar crash soon. However, I will not care much as I rarely buy games for my PS2 anymore.

[MegaManFan]

Kepone said:

In other words, they need less sequels and more games that are innovative. Hell, Grand Theft Auto:Vice is not much different from GTA3. It's not better in any way. Sure, there's better weapons and a different story. It's still not very innovative.

Yes, but GTA3 was a quantum leap ahead of GTA2. Sometimes, sequels are an evolutionary step ahead. Just imagine what people who played FF2/4 or FF3/6 on Super Nintendo must have thought the first time they saw Final Fantasy VII on a PlayStation.

[Vic George 2K3]

MegaManFan said:

Yes, but GTA3 was a quantum leap ahead of GTA2.  Sometimes, sequels are an evolutionary step ahead.  Just imagine what people who played FF2/4 or FF3/6 on Super Nintendo must have thought the first time they saw Final Fantasy VII on a PlayStation.

That I can agree on...as long as enough of the basic elements of what made the original game fun to play are still intact. If there's very little change, a sequel might as rank as nothing more than a rehash or like a game hack of the original.

[Foxy Cleopatra]

Kepone said:

For example, compare it to the pharmeutical industry. They're constantly coming out with drugs that are similar or no better than drugs that have been released and marketed to the public ahead of time. It's no longer about innovation, but rather about profits and padding the wallets of the contagious fat cats that run pharmeutical companies. Profit =desire and desire= profit.  

Speaking as some one who worked in the pharm industry, I can tell you that the FDA will not approve a product that has no increased efficacy, less side effects/ toxicity than a similar product on the market, unless it is a generic. Generic's are expected to have the same effect as the brand name, but that involves a whole different series of clinicals... so the comparison does not really hold up in that regard but I agree with what you are saying

[Dracula-X]

Kepone said:

This would spell the end of the games industry as we know it. Where have the David Cranes of the software world gone? This is exactly what led to the great videogame crash of 1983. Less innovation and more repetition. I predict a similar crash soon. However, I will not care much as I rarely buy games for my PS2 anymore.

I totally agree with you, and I also think it is very important to make a distinction that alot of people simply aren't aware of and as a result developers shoulder the blame unfairly. The console industry is driven by publishers. Your typical development house (not the big boys like capcom/konami/etc) is not in a position to push an original title because most publishers will not gamble on it. There are circumstances where a publisher would remodel a game presented to them that they are interested in (rare!) to include a license, as licenses == $$$ and publishers seldom settle for less. Usually publishers simply dictate what they want and developers line up for the contracts. Newcomers (developers) to the industry have it really rough (and I not only speak from personal experience but for friends in the industry today who had similar experiences) A friend of mine along with a team created a wonderful gba game last year and sadly it will not see the light of day because the publishers either a) like the game but refuse to publish as is because there is no recognizable license attached to the game or b) the publisher is simply interested in the talent and will hire the team to develop other games of the publishers choosing, in-house, and yet others look to break up the team and either recruit the programmer, or another member. I hear similar stories in other circles. Arguably the next big problems are the 'suits' that run the show at both publishing and development outfits who know little or nothing of gaming in general. The industry is in dire straights right now and alot of developers are closing shop (check out whats going on in the UK now). I don't think we'll see the same crash we saw in the 80's however, but I'm sure things will undoubtedly get worse before they get better.

Things may change significantly in the next few years for the better, probably with the advent of the next generation of consoles (ps3/xbox2/etc) - It was something Sony planned to do with the PS2 (before they even released the console) but broadband hadn't caught on fast enough and plans were delayed: To cut out the middle man and have users optionally download full games straight from Sony to a PS2 harddrive and pass on significant savings to the consumer as a result. This could herald the return of innovation if you don't need to deal with publishers - and could be a better world for all xbox2ers/ps3ers/gamecube2?gamesphere?gametrapezoid?whats next from Nin? (sorry for the long post )

[Ze_ro]

Vic George 2K2 said:

as long as enough of the basic elements of what made the original game fun to play are still intact.  If there's very little change, a sequel might as rank as nothing more than a rehash or like a game hack of the original.

That's kind of tricky though, as there are a lot of games that break that rule. When you look at games like Asteroids Deluxe, Stargate/Defender II, or Super Space Invaders, there really doesn't seem to be much added to them to really make them a sequel (Although back then, small changed seemed more noticable). Meanwhile, Tempest 2000 has essentially the same gameplay (Yes, there's new enemies and powerups, but the visual effects do more to change the gameplay), yet is definitely a sequel.

Maybe it's just a sign of the times where a sequel is expected to be far superior... I guess that's why so many PC games get "expansion packs" instead of sequels sometimes.

I'm still waiting for Mario Kart Cube... I can't believe how little information there is on this one. Nintendo better be hard at work on this.

--Zero

[MegaManFan]

Ze_ro said:

I'm still waiting for Mario Kart Cube... I can't believe how little information there is on this one. Nintendo better be hard at work on this.

--Zero

I really don't see what more can be done to Mario Kart at this point. Although I like a lot of sequels that take old games and expand on them in new ways, some Nintendo sequels don't. Dr. Mario 64? Come on. I already own Mario Kart on N64 and SNES so I don't think third time around is the charm for me.

[Xot]

MegaManFan said:

Ze_ro said:

I'm still waiting for Mario Kart Cube... I can't believe how little information there is on this one. Nintendo better be hard at work on this.

--Zero

I really don't see what more can be done to Mario Kart at this point. Although I like a lot of sequels that take old games and expand on them in new ways, some Nintendo sequels don't. Dr. Mario 64? Come on. I already own Mario Kart on N64 and SNES so I don't think third time around is the charm for me.

I would think one who calls himself "MegaManFan" would not be too critical of sequels.

I agree with you on Dr. Mario 64. Game play was absolutely UNCHANGED other than the 4 player mode, which was what sucked me in. I was PISSED when I paid $30 for it new and it was the exact same f***ing game.

[MegaManFan]

Xot said:

I would think one who calls himself "MegaManFan" would not be too critical of sequels.  

Okay, I admit I have a bit of a blind spot for Mega Man. But as you'll see above, I'm definitely not opposed to game sequels as long as they improve on the original (again my example of GTA2 to GTA3, or FF3/6 to FFVII).

Xot said:

I agree with you on Dr. Mario 64. Game play was absolutely UNCHANGED other than the 4 player mode, which was what sucked me in. I was PISSED when I paid $30 for it new and it was the exact same f***ing game.

I honestly wondered if they even changed the code at all. Maybe if you didn't already own Dr. Mario on NES, SNES, or GameBoy beforehand, you +might+ have an interest in an N64 version - but otherwise it's one of the worst examples of a "sequel" of all time.