31 replies to this topic

[Xot]

You *can't.* There are far too many areas to explore that you need to get the other abilities before you can reach.

It wasn't until I was at about the 40% mark that I started to realize how HUGE this game is.

[kisrael]

Xot said:

It wasn't until I was at about the 40% mark that I started to realize how HUGE this game is.  

Huge, but surprisingly linear overall. There's a lot of backtracking, but overall it's geared so that you have to everything pretty much in order...

[MegaManFan]

You know, not to be a PITA, but I'm getting a little tired of the word "linear" being used as a diss. If you read a good book from start to finish, it's pretty linear, but that doesn't mean the experience wasn't wholly engrossing all the same. Sometimes I think I actually prefer an RPG that starts somewhere and ends somewhere through a series of fixed events rather than one that has you going everywhere trying to figure out what to do next and what people want. Sometimes, one thing after another is pretty cool.

[kisrael]

MegaManFan said:

You know, not to be a PITA, but I'm getting a little tired of the word "linear" being used as a diss.  If you read a good book from start to finish, it's pretty linear, but that doesn't mean the experience wasn't wholly engrossing all the same.

I don't quite mean it as a total put-down (or "diss", to use your hipster slang) but it's definately a criticism. As a linear medium, video games don't stand up that well to books or movies; with some exceptions, they tend to have a lot less depth than either. (I do grant that you might connect with a linear story video game more than with, say, a movie, because of your involvement in it.) But I definately prefer games that have a complex enough world that I feel I have some freedom. And when Metroid moved into 3D, the way it lets you "see but don't touch" things (ike, you know you need to go there, but you don't have the right powerup) is a little annoying.

I think I've been spoiled a bit by GTA3 and VC, which really combine the best of both worlds; a decent story line to follow, and a big world to play in during and after. Plus, a few storylines at once, and you pick what you want to focus on. What I like about GTA3 and I guess I'd say Mario as opposed to Metroid and Zelda is that there's not much powering up with those first two; your character and his armament is basically the same (or potentially the same) at the end of the game as it was at the begining, and the game isn't so contrived to keep you from certain parts of itself because you don't have the right doodad.

Megaman is an interesting case: historically (I stopped playing MegaMan roughly with the SNES so I don't know about the latest versions) it's all about acquiring new terrific weapons...but I think it's cool that it lets you select to still try any board, and even have a bit of a shot, even without the optimal weapon in your arsenal. And each weapon tends to have different purposes and strengths, unlike Metroid and Zelda, where it's just a cooler, more gadgety form of leveling up really.

[Xot]

I will grant that Metroid Prime is more linear than its predecessors, but it's not very linear at all. The game does point you in the next direction, so to speak, but it's not required that you do so. You can pick up several items and most of the artifacts in any order you wish; the beauty of Prime is that you CAN explore these vast areas of terrain and be rewarded by finding items, rather than being turned away for not having the right item. Sure, there is that element of "you need this item to pass" but it's much better implemented in Prime where you're physically not capable of travelling there than the trite "You need a red key" crap.

Also, the way the use of items complement each other is great. Using different visors and different weapons. It's slightly more cerebral than just "try everything in your arsenal."

If you want linear, try playing Metroid Fusion. The game pretty much chastises you for going the wrong way.

[MegaManFan]

Xot said:

If you want linear, try playing Metroid Fusion. The game pretty much chastises you for going the wrong way.

On that I will have to agree. I got so sick of the ship's computer telling me where to go that I tried to ignore orders and go back to the habitation deck, but I actually encountered some quirky bug apparently triggered by me entering an area too early: the lift exploded and the only chamber I could enter was a bomb through the right side wall, which had no exits except back out the way I came in (which also had no exits). After ten - fifteen minutes of futility, I turned it off and went back to my last save. Stupid #%#% ship's computer.

Having thought about it a lot since Xot's post, I have to totally concur. Prime is a LOT less linear than Fusion; although ironically, I think Fusion might just be a little more fun since it's so close to the 2-D heritage of Metroid and Super Metroid that made this series so great.

[kisrael]

MegaManFan said:

Xot said:

If you want linear, try playing Metroid Fusion. The game pretty much chastises you for going the wrong way.

On that I will have to agree.

Huh. Do you think the linear setup plus automapping means people who prefered to play the previous Metroids w/ guide (curse you old NES Players Guide w/ the black cover for setting me down this road of Map and Walkthrus! will be less likely to need something like GameFAQs?

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Having thought about it a lot since Xot's post, I have to totally concur.  Prime is a LOT less linear than Fusion; although ironically, I think Fusion might just be a little more fun since it's so close to the 2-D heritage of Metroid and Super Metroid that made this series so great.

Yeah, I remember the day both came out...I didn't have a GBA, and I almost felt a twinge of "You know, I think I'd rather be trying the 2D game..."

Re: the "linearity" of Prime; to me, that kind of "exploring" feels more like "searching" and I don't enjoy it that much. (And that's the main reason I rely on guides; I hate to not have the maximum #s of missiles and energy tanks but I also hate searching and scanning and bombing every dang part) And I think I find "physical access barred w/o the right gadget" to something like, say, Mario or Megaman does, where it has a straightforward level select. Yeah, I know that would break the whole Metroid immersion vibe so isn't an option, but still... I guess what bugs me about Prime is that it feels like it SHOULD be a "found planet", a real world that you can explore, but in reality, just about every aspect of it is precisely geared to your character's specific abilities at some point in the game.

Heh, it's almost like creationism vs. evolution; Prime's world is really obviously created for the player, with that fine tweaking. Something like GTA:VC feels more evolved; it seems like a consistent universe that is there for reasons other than the player to respond to. Admittedly the latter has the advantage of being set in a pseudo-realistic modernday world, so it's easier to make it look like there's a "real economy" and "real social structure" (even if the engine's tendency to appear disappear pedestrians and other cars strains credulity)

Maybe GTA series isn't a fair example, because I really think they brought something new and cool to the table, and that's why they've had such runaway success.