33 replies to this topic

[Defiance131]

Found this while checking out San Jose State's retooled website. Jack Trammiel will be speaking to a communications class about his holocaust experiences on Sept. 30. More info right here.

Not sure how much he'll talk about Atari, but I know there are enough of you near SJSU where you might be able to listen to the talk.

[NovaXpress]

That should go over well, after a two-hour holocaust presentation the first question will be "Why didn't you release the 7800 in 1984?"

[Room 34]

Aww man... don't tell me Jack Tramiel was a holocaust survivor. I don't want to feel guilty for hating the guy!

[King Atari]

Sure was, and I think his wife was, too.

I hate the guy and I don't feel guilty.

[Room 34]

OK, now I don't feel bad anymore. That link you gave refers to him as "the founder of Atari."

Oh, the humanity!!!!

* Note: I have been to Auschwitz and Berkenau. I was driven to tears by the experience. So please don't think I am making light of the holocaust. It was one of the darkest periods in all of human history.

[AtariDude]

He may have gone through a bad experience but that does not excuse him for what some people feel that he did when he took over Atari. I think he did not advertise enough in the U.S. and that really hurt because Atari was out of sight and out of mind for most people.

[Room 34]

"Bad experience" is the understatement of the (20th) century. But your point is valid. Trauma that you've suffered at some point in your life does not automatically and arbitrarily excuse your unrelated behavior after the experience.

[NovaXpress]

Question #2: "Stop crying about the millions slaughtered and tell us where the Swordquest prizes are you bastard!"

[Defiance131]

I figured you guys would get a kick out of that link.

If anyone goes, they'll have to make a full report.

[JB]

NovaXpress said:

Question #2:  "Stop crying about the millions slaughtered and tell us where the Swordquest prizes are you bastard!"

BAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!

[AtariDude]

My question to him would be "Why did you guys shut down the contest? You guys still needed to create the last game in the series!"

Followed by why did they not spend more money advertising the ST in the U.S. It was such a good machine but other than in computer magazines, I don't remember seeing too much advertising for the computer.

[eric_ruck]

I wish I was in CA on Sep 30, if I was I'd try to make it, but alas I'm on the east coast that week.

Wasn't JT actually the (or a) founder of Commodore? I guess if I were him I'd rather be associated to Atari because they're still around, sort of.

Eric

[davidcalgary29]

I always enjoy hearing peoples' opinions of Jack Tramiel (and family), because it does vary so widely with context. My father, who was never interested in home computing, did start to read my old copies of "Antic" after the Tramiel takeover because a) he's Jewish (providing a positive role model (at the time) for Jewish computer geeks everywhere) and b) he spent much of his adult life (and founded Commodore) in Toronto, where our family is from. I always found it interesting to watch my father filter the entire Atari Tramiel episode through a lens of Judaism.

The local Commodore group also view the Tramiels as gods. They don't care what happened at Atari, of course, but the club executive never fail to mention that Commodore "went down the toilet" as soon as Jack Tramiel left!

[AtariDude]

eric_ruck said:

I wish I was in CA on Sep 30, if I was I'd try to make it, but alas I'm on the east coast that week.

Wasn't JT actually the (or a) founder of Commodore?  I guess if I were him I'd rather be associated to Atari because they're still around, sort of.

Eric

Yes. He was the founder of Commodore Business Machines. It originally started out as a typewriter repair company, then they started making calulators before they got into the computer field. They bought MOS technologies which allowed them to create the first commodore computers like the ViC-20, C64, etc.

[Jess Ragan]

I've been a fan of Commodore for a very long time. My first computer was a VIC-20! I was tickled pink when I found a Commodore adding machine (!!!) at a yard sale when I was a kid. Unfortunately, I didn't take good care of it and now it's in far less than mint condition. (sigh)

Anyway, I've got to give Tramiel credit for building Commodore from the ground up, but the man really was a slimeball. He'd order parts from other companies, then refuse to pay them. Eventually, these companies would go bankrupt due to lack of income, and that fat vulture would swoop in, buy the businesses, and cancel his debt to them.

You'd think someone who spent years in a concentration camp would have learned a great deal of compassion from the experience. Instead, it seems like all Jack Tramiel learned was how to emulate the behavior of the Nazis who enslaved him.

JR

[Brad2600]

I could care less if he were speaking or not.

He was a crappy businessman who singlehandly brought down the greatest video game company in the world.

Period.

[King Atari]

Yeah, if I met him, I'd kick him in the hoo ha just for what he dikd to the 7800. Then maybe again because I don't like him. Then I'd apologize for what he went through during WWII. Then I'd kick again because that's no excuse.

[2600Lives]

Well, the bastard said it himself. "Business is war, and I don't intend to lose." So then, why didn't someone just shoot him in the head? I don't care if all his damn family was killed by the Nazi's, he should have, gawd forbid, LEARNED from this experience and not treated other people like shit. It's just no excuse. He became his own worst enemy. Personally, I hope he goes bankrupt and has to go work retail, because I'd make it a point to move to where he works and go into his store every single day just to make his life that much more miserable.

[Gamemaster_ca_2003]

"King Atari" said:

Yeah, if I met him, I'd kick him in the hoo ha just for what he dikd to the 7800. Then maybe again because I don't like him. Then I'd apologize for what he went through during WWII. Then I'd kick again because that's no excuse.

You can do that you will be charged with assault but you can still do that.

I have been stating this fact since i got here. Trammel's desicion is crap now but back in 1984 that move was a good one because no one could predict the future, and even if Jack Trammel was killed by the nazis the person who would have bought atari in 84 would have done the same thing.

[JB]

Kepone said:

I could care less if he were speaking or not.

He was a crappy businessman who singlehandly brought down the greatest video game company in the world.

Period.

Aww, surely TimeWarner helped a LITTLE.

[MegaManFan]

Tramiel's shameless cancellation of any good Atari Labs innovation and enthusiasm for shitting on every game console they had in favor of PC's also helped a lot.

[MsPacBitch]

I'll always remember the Next Generation magazine article where he stated that "the Playstation is a little more powerful than the Jaguar, a little." and then went on to say that the Jaguar was more powerful than the Saturn and that the only thing separating the Playstation and the Jaguar was more a bit more memory in the Playstation.

Sure, I didn't expect him to say that his dying console had zilch software support and a library of mostly crap games and that the CD add-on looked like a toilet (he also said he expected half of all Jaguar owner to buy the CD attachment), but I was surprised at the audacity of his lies.

Sorry he had such a terrible childhood. The Holocaust is one the the biggest and most shameful examples of human cruelty ever. That being said, Jack is lying, stealing turdbucket.

[Mindfield]

It's funny how everyone blames Jack for the sole reason Atari foundered and died. Fact is, Ray Kassar at TW started that ball rolling with his autocratic rule, determination to stamp out anything resembling fun, and refusal to acknowledge anyone's individual efforts. (That was, however, the catalyst that brought Activision and thus the whole third party game industry to life, so there's a silver lining to that dark cloud)

Moreover Jack retired a few years after taking Atari over, handing the reigns to his sons Gary, Leonard and Sam. They were at the helm when Atari sunk like a stone. Me? I blame those three stooges. Sure, Jack wasn't the greatest businessman when it came to Atari and he made some colossal blunders (did somebody say Amiga Lorraine? And where's that 7800 you promised? Come to think of it, Swordquest...) but he wasn't nearly the first and last nail in Atari's coffin.

[DracIsBack]

Kepone said:

I could care less if he were speaking or not.

He was a crappy businessman who singlehandly brought down the greatest video game company in the world.

Period.

Actually, he was quite a good businessman.

While I too wish that he'd done a lot of things differently for the sake of the gaming consoles and the computers I loved, a lot of the armchair CEO's on these forums would have put Atari out of business in six months after taking over. What Jack was able to salvage for twelve years in the market conditions he had was pretty impressive - from a business sense.

[DracIsBack]

MegaManFan said:

Tramiel's shameless cancellation of any good Atari Labs innovation and enthusiasm for shitting on every game console they had in favor of PC's also helped a lot.

Yes, but remember something:

Atari was losing $2 million/day as a result of video games. The retailers that carried the video games were revolting and refusing to carry the inventory of future consoles. The market was saturated with unsold games and the price that the companies were getting for them wouldn't cover manufacturing costs let alone development costs. Mattel was getting out of the business. Coleco was saved by Cabbage Patch Kids but the video games were hemmoraging. Activision lost money. Smaller companies were folding. Sears, Atari's biggest reseller was refusing to carry games.

Atari, thanks to Warner, was in the driver's seat for this.

Yeah, I wish Jack had brought out the 7800 in 1984 too ... but I understand why he was reluctant to dive full-force into the industry.

In the end, the Jaguar (a console) was indeed Atari's main focus.