209 replies to this topic

[kisrael]

pmartin252]I don't think you should make the game too much harder at the start as that can get frustrating, on and if you introduced forward/backward movement it would spoil the basic, said:

This would only be an option for a larger version. I would add this like the real physics of a helicopter would work, so by going forward you are diving a bit faster and by going backword you can climb a bit faster. This would allow some really tricky manouevres.

It would be a different and generally tougher game...

Heh, parts of the description remind me of the control of the old Intellivision "Triple Action" Biplanes mode. It might be "too realistic" relative to the rest of the game to work well...but it might be interesting, so while I definately wouldn't want it to make up all of the gameplay, it might be good as a different Game Select level.

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As always there are many solutions:
- remove the randomness, so you you have to remember the layout and have a chance to plan ahead of time (maybe with a varying initial random seed whenever you insert the cart)
- position the helicopter even more to the left, to give you some extra time for reaction
- make the helicopter faster, though this will make controling it a bit tougher
- reduce difficulty by spacing the walls a bit more and make them narrower.
- change the ratio between gravity and the helicopter power (currently the gravity factor is 25% larger, so it's a good strategy to fly a little bit higher)

What do you think?

-randomness: one cool Palm version of this game had a "competition mode" that was the same game every time, and a randomized mode. This also harks back to the level selects on Adventure...
-helicopter to the left is probably good
-re: gravity. I think a symmetrical gravity accel vs thrust accel is nice in this game...it's funny that I didn't notice that one was stronger than the other.

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BTW: No comments about calling it "Push-It!"?

As much as you aren't crazy about my German names, I'm not crazy about this English one "Push-It" sounds like it's going to be about...well, pushing something, ala Sokoban or something. So far I think it's current name "Cave" is the best short name ala Thrust. I guess you didn't like "Danger Cave" or "Helicopter Havoc" or any of those. "Rotor"? "Throttle"?

If you made a version that was flying into the cave, dropping off a bomb, and flying out (the way you came in, right?) that would merit a different set of names, like "Atomic Cave" or "Bomb Drop" or something.

[Schmutzpuppe]

Cool version, like it much.
I like the sound better than the one from my version Superfly 1k (witch is an entry at the minigame compo).
You choose the way to fasten the scrolling to make the game more difficult, I used the way to make the hindrance bigger and gaps between them smaller during play so Cave 1k is much faster.
I am not unhappy that Cave didn’t make it for this year Compo because it would be a hard competitor for the 1k category
If it is possible you should show the actual and the highscore at the end of the game.
Overall great work

One thing that I don’t understand is that superfly (as the first Atari entry at the minigame combo) wasn’t worth a mention for the AA news.
I submitted the news but never got a feedback.
Looks as if the Atari computer standing isn’t that high at AA

Matthias

[Albert]

Gateway said:

@Thomas: Will you still be allowed to enter the 1K contest next year with this game, even if it is released on carts? I believe you can win the competition with this one!  

Several homebrew games released in cartridge form were submitted (and accepted) for this year's competition. So it should not be a problem for Thomas to submit Cave 1K if he decides to make the game available in cartridge form.

..Al

[Albert]

Schmutzpuppe said:

One thing that I don’t understand is that superfly (as the first Atari entry at the minigame combo) wasn’t worth a mention for the AA news.
I submitted the news but never got a feedback.
Looks as if the Atari computer standing isn’t that high at AA

Hmmmm, I don't remember seeing that email, but it's quite possible that I accidently skipped over it or deleted it with a bunch of spam. I just looked at the Minigame Compo page and see it listed there. We post plenty of 8-bit and ST-related news, so it wasn't because we don't love the Atari computers (we are working on an 8-bit section for AA now). Sorry about that, we didn't intentionally slight you there..

..Al

[Thomas Jentzsch]

kisrael said:

-randomness: one cool Palm version of this game had a "competition mode" that was the same game every time, and a randomized mode. This also harks back to the level selects on Adventure..

Good idea! .

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-helicopter to the left is probably good

Done already!

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-re: gravity. I think a symmetrical gravity accel vs thrust accel is nice in this game...it's funny that I didn't notice that one was stronger than the other.

Hm, I thought a little assymetry would add some minimal strategy to the game.

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As much as you aren't crazy about my German names, I'm not crazy about this English one  "Push-It" sounds like it's going to be about...well, pushing something, ala <A href="http://www.cs.ualberta.ca/~games/Sokoban/">Sokoban</a> or something.

I understand, so how about a simple "Push!"

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So far I think it's current name "Cave" is the best short name ala Thrust.  I guess you didn't like "Danger Cave" or "Helicopter Havoc" or any of those.  "Rotor"? "Throttle"?

Still too long!

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If you made a version that was flying into the cave, dropping off a bomb, and flying out (the way you came in, right?) that would merit a different set of names, like "Atomic Cave" or "Bomb Drop" or something.

Looks like I'll better wait until I know how the final game will look like.

I have posted (see 1st post) a new version (1.03) with lots of modified parameters:
- the helicopter is further to the left
- the helicopter is slightly faster when moving up and down
- the intitial cave speed is a bit faster, but increases only half as fast now
- the initial wall height is a bit taller, the maximum height is slightly reduced
- the minimum distance between two walls is slightly increased

This should make the game fairer at higher difficulties (and all old scores a invalid now! ).

[Schmutzpuppe]

Albert said:

We post plenty of 8-bit and ST-related news, so it wasn't because we don't love the Atari computers (we are working on an 8-bit section for AA now).  Sorry about that, we didn't intentionally slight you there..

..Al

Ok, that can happed, good to hear that i was wrong about the standing

[Nukey Shay]

Albert intentionally pass up news regarding the Atari 8-bit?

Vizzini said:

Inconceivable!

[Thomas Jentzsch]

Schmutzpuppe said:

Cool version, like it much.
I like the sound better than the one from my version Superfly 1k (witch is an entry at the minigame compo).

Thanks!
Actually it was your entry that gave me the final kick to make an Atari 2600 version.

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You choose the way to fasten the scrolling to make the game more difficult, I used the way to make the hindrance bigger and gaps between them smaller during play so Cave 1k is much faster.

Yup, IMO that faster speed matches the "style" of Atari 2600 games better.

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I am not unhappy that Cave didn?t make it for this year Compo because it would be a hard competitor for the 1k category

When I'll submit it next year, please don't post an updated version of your game.

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If it is possible you should show the actual and the highscore at the end of the game.

I am doing that! The red score is the highscore and the white one the current score.

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One thing that I don?t understand is that superfly (as the first Atari entry at the minigame combo) wasn?t worth a mention for the AA news.
I submitted the news but never got a feedback.
Looks as if the Atari computer standing isn?t that high at AA

I don't think this was intentional, the Als are just usually quite busy all the time.

And AFAIK most (all?) Atari submissions to the contest wheren't mentioned in the news.

[Schmutzpuppe]

Thomas Jentzsch said:

Thanks!
Actually it was your entry that gave me the final kick to make an Atari 2600 version.

Thomas Jentzsch said:

Yup, IMO that faster speed matches the "style" of Atari 2600 games better.

Maybe right, it's more action that way maybe i should update superfly

Thomas Jentzsch said:

When I'll submit it next year, please don't post an updated version of your game.

Hehe, maybe there will be an update but not for the compo.
All the best for you next year.

Thomas Jentzsch said:

I am doing that! The red score is the highscore and the white one the current score.

What i mean is show both score at the same time, it gives a group of people more time to see who is no. 2

Matthias

PS: "Fliege mit dem Hubschrauber durch die endlose, gefährliche Höhle ohne irgendwo anzustoßen!" ist doch ein geiler Titel, nur hat man dann schon das kb fast voll.....

[Thomas Jentzsch]

Schmutzpuppe said:

Hehe, maybe there will be an update but not for the compo.
All the best for you next year.

Thanks, I hope I dont miss it (and they don't change the categories).

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What i mean is show both score at the same time, it gives a group of people more time to see who is no. 2

That's a problem because it would need more ROM and the Atari 2600 can only do 6 digits in a row without flicker. And even the code for that 6 digit routine would require more ROM than I have left.

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PS: "Fliege mit dem Hubschrauber durch die endlose, gefährliche Höhle ohne irgendwo anzustoßen!" ist doch ein geiler Titel, nur hat man dann schon das kb fast voll.....

Zur Not kann ich's ja abkürzen: FMDHDDEGHOIA.

Hm, "Dodge!" might be a nice title too...

[kisrael]

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Hm, "Dodge!" might be a nice title too...

Dodge isn't bad, but it risks sounding like "Dodge 'Em".

"Swerve!" ?

"Soar" -- sounds too much like "Sore".

"Dive!" -- sounds more like a submarine game than a helicopter game.

"Duck!" --dang, too bad that's the name of the bird as well. Maybe you could change it from a copter to a Mallard?

[kisrael]

Two more:

"Climb!" -- unfortunately it also means, like, climbing a mountain.

"Swoop!" -- ooh, that one might work well...it describes the motion of the 'Copter and is one syllable, and doesn't mean anything else...

[Albert]

"Fly!"
"Panic!"
"React!"
"Suicide Run" (oh, wait...)

What the heck is a helicopter doing in a cave, anyway?

..Al

[Nukey Shay]

...crashing if you're not careful.

Maybe the pilot was a Bond villian?

[Thomas Jentzsch]

kisrael said:

"Swoop!" -- ooh, that one might work well...it describes the motion of the 'Copter and is one syllable, and doesn't mean anything else...

"Swoop" doesn't sound bad.

Albert said:

What the heck is a helicopter doing in a cave, anyway?  

Having fun?

Before getting distracted by the name too much: Any comments about the new version? Better

[Nukey Shay]

Yeah...I can play upwards of 60 seconds now

About the "cave" thing...perhaps it could be changed into a bat...or wait a minute...a Bat-copter That way it would satisfy the Bat-fans who missed out on a Bat-cart back in the Bat-day. And your mission is to fly out of the Bat-cave to save your young ward who has been kidnapped by the Joker. But first, you have to navigate around the Bat-security systems that Joker has booby-trapped and turned against you. Am I going off on another tangent here? Darn...robots are stealing my meds again

[Thomas Jentzsch]

Nukey Shay said:

Yeah...I can play upwards of 60 seconds now

Oh, looks like it became too easy now.

[SS]

Thomas Jentzsch said:

kisrael said:

So far I think it's current name "Cave" is the best short name ala Thrust.  I guess you didn't like "Danger Cave" or "Helicopter Havoc" or any of those.  "Rotor"? "Throttle"?

Still too long!

It seems like a mini-game should have a mini-name.

Still, too bad that "Up N Down" is already taken

[Albert]

I just played several times, and I like the improvements you have done. It will take some practice, due to the quicker up and down movements, to have as much "finesse" as before. But I like how you start the game out faster and how the helicopter has been pushed back a bit. I'll spend some more time playing later, but I have some errands to do now, and I haven't eaten lunch yet.

..Al

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[Gateway]

Albert said:

What the heck is a helicopter doing in a cave, anyway?  

..Al

Spelunking!

How 'bout SPELUNK! for a title( ala PITFALL! )?

I still like: STALAGFLIGHT for a title.

Or how 'bout just : Cavern

Also: STRATA

[mozz1]

Stella is actually at v1.2 on the Mac and runs fine on OS X (10.2).
You can download it via www.emulation.net or directly form the link below


http://homepage.mac....s/stella-12.sit

[Thomas Jentzsch]

mozz1 said:

Stella is actually at v1.2 on the Mac and runs fine on OS X (10.2).

Yup, but not until using the core of version 1.3 it will support illegal opcodes (e.g. try Thrust).

[Gregory DG]

'Copter Cavern!

[Thomas Jentzsch]

Gateway said:

I still like: STALAGFLIGHT for a title.

And how would you explain stalag[m|t]ites hanging in the air?

But then, how do you explain walls hanging in the air at all?

Hm, I could make the walls growing and some of them moving down... Nasty!

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Or how 'bout just : Cavern

Too simple.

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Also: STRATA

I have translated that into German, but I don't get the idea. It translates into something like "layers"

Anyway: I want more feedback about the gameplay, the name is still secondary now :!:

[Thomas Jentzsch]

Gregory DG said:

'Copter Cavern!  

Or "Cavecopter"?

Damn, I really should stop replying to those...